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Based on what we've seen, should Ishuu really be Ash's first League win?

Would you feel comfortable with Ash winning the League in Ishuu?

  • Yes, it would be about time

    Votes: 13 18.6%

  • No, because the way BW has been handled

    Votes: 35 50.0%

  • Epic battles/Character development is all I look for in Leagues

    Votes: 16 22.9%

  • IDK

    Votes: 6 8.6%
  • Total voters
    70
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Cascada

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It just seems to me, that every other region, Ash was more worthy of being called a League Champion. At least his first League win, mostly Sinnoh and Kanto, but Ishuu just does not have that vibe.

I mean, am I alone on this one? It's hard to believe that with Trip's lackluster development and personality, Bianca so far being a punching bag, and the rotation system not flowing correctly, that Ash truly deserves to win this League, not based on an amount of accomplishments he has, because he has many, and I know we ALL want him to win one by now, but to me it would seem rather tacky, and if Ash won Ishuu I really could see it only being because the writers have made a League win Long Overdue.

I could be very wrong here. Ash could still win this League, and who knows things may pick up later on in the saga. I still have high hopes for Best Wishes, but honestly, the best route they could go now, is improve in terms of story and have Ash come in 2nd place.

I always thought that. Ash has never gotten 2nd, and 2nd is the most of a "so close, but still have a long way to go" League position one could get. Ash has yet to get this, and I believe he should this region.

I just think it's so tacky to not include any of Ash's past in his first League win, if Ishuu is really it. It's hard seeing Ash lose again, but with no cameos so far this saga, and no older pokemon of his participating with this new rotation system, it would feel as if DP was cheated out of a League win, just IMO.

Overall, I like Best Wishes, but if Ash were to win, is it justified based on region and saga, not based on Ash deserving a win for so long now just to get it over with?
 
No. Ash should have won the Sinnoh league since back then there was build up for him to.
 
Lol, I actually expect Bianca to win the Unova League.

I've lost faith in Ash ever winning a league, so I doubt it will happen here.
 
I don't think that Ash was worthy to be the Champion back in the Kanto League. Most of his Gym badges weren't earned through winning a match and most of his battles in the league were pretty cheap or just bad. Given how his Kanto journey went, it would be unrealistic for Ash to win his first League. The only leagues where I thought Ash had a chance of winning it were Sinnoh and possibly Hoenn.

I don't think it would satisfying to see Ash win the Unova League at this rate. Most of his Unova Pokemon are underdeveloped, battle wise and in term of their personalities, and while his Gym battles aren't nearly as bad as some of the battles in Kanto, his skills don't really give me the impression that he would be able to win the Unova League at this point. If they did have Ash win the league, it would feel unsatisfying and basically would be done because the plot said so, instead of Ash's hard training with his Pokemon paid off to give him a victory. I'm hoping for some enjoyable battles and character interactions in the Unova League, as league battles are usually some of the best battles from their series, but I'm not expecting Ash to win it with the whole Unova League at this point.
 
I think it's safe to assume nothing, so I don't expect anything anyway; however, the skills presented by Ash in this saga does not give me much confidence in him at all. In fact, they've pretty much destroyed any thought that Ash can maintain the standing he had in Sinnoh. That's right, they've actually made me consider him going backwards. The writers have a lot to make up for to me, but possibly they can still do it, but it'll take a rather drastic turnaround to accomplish that. The Ash who fought Tobias might've had a chance to win a League, but now, he'll be lucky if Stephen doesn't come back and squash him flat.
 
Samurott said:
I think it's safe to assume nothing, so I don't expect anything anyway; however, the skills presented by Ash in this saga does not give me much confidence in him at all. In fact, they've pretty much destroyed any thought that Ash can maintain the standing he had in Sinnoh.
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I agree, as it's been said before the Ash this season seems to have taken a few leaps backwards. I'm sure it was done because he's supposed to be the "newbie" of the group, but honestly they could have kept him more level-headed and less scatter brained.

At this point, I find it hard to believe that he'll have what it takes to defeat a legendary. Unless, he re-improves himself to the level he was at in AG, and DP...I'm going to find it very hard to believe that he'll somehow end up being better this season, than the last.
 
In my opinion, we have seen episodes in BW that hint that Satoshi could win the Isshu League and others that don't, because ultimately, before BW there was a sort of logical progression. In Kanto, Satoshi didn't earn his badges and befriended Pokémon that were already strong and adult as opposed to raise and train them. In Johto he started with a fresh roster of younger and less experienced pokémon and started to learn how to raise a team. In Hoenn, he showed he was actually able to raise a team on his own. In DP, he put those skills in practice and started figuring out who he was as a trainer and his own style, refine his technique, etc. All of these steps were consistant in their portrayal and organically evolved from one another.

In BW, we see glimpses of what Satoshi was at the end of DP, in the recent training episodes of Mijumaru for example, where he's still that naive kid, but actually knows what he's doing. But there are other episodes where he seems totally clueless and amateurish. There's no consistency in his portrayal anymore, so it's impossible to say which Satoshi will show up at the Isshu League.

But in the "he will win" side of things, Satoshi's rival all seem kinda weaker than him, even Shooti, compared to the rivals in Diamond and Pearl. Not only Shinji, but the other League participants seemed much more dangerous than their counterpart in BW. Right now, I feel it's Satoshi's League to win or lose, but like Zidane, I have a sneaking suspicion that Bel might win it all.
 
At this point I truly do not care anymore. I want him to win the League so his storyline can move on. Does he honestly have the skills too? No. He's nowhere near capable enough to do it. The only time I thought he was at the right level was back in Sinnoh. He was closer in Hoenn than he'd been before, but it wasn't quite close enough. You could still see that he'd made a massive improvement since Kanto though. In Sinnoh...basically Ash was at the top of his game. He had the mindset, the experience, the techniques; he could've gone all the way. Now, with the decrease in his skills and overall character I doubt he could beat any of his past rivals, much less the opponents he'd face in a league competition.
 
With the way BW has progressed thus far, I'm inclined to say no. Ash hasn't trained his Pokémon nearly as much as he's done in AG and DP this far into the series, and he hasn't been using much strategy in his battles; lately, they've consisted of hit, hit, hit until the foe is down.

Now do I think he'll actually win? Possibly. If the writers continue his improving by one spot each league (disregarding Johto -> Hoenn where he achieved the same ranking in both), he'll at least make the finals; for all we know, they may plan to take him all the way to the top.
 
IMO, I don't think the writers will have him win a league (Orange Islands doesn't count here, imo), unless the series itself is coming to an end. Think about it. If he wins a league (a canon one), what's left for him to achieve? How would the writers top that?
 
SSJ_Jup81 said:
IMO, I don't think the writers will have him win a league (Orange Islands doesn't count here, imo), unless the series itself is coming to an end. Think about it. If he wins a league (a canon one), what's left for him to achieve? How would the writers top that?
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Winning a one league, while impressive, doesn't really mean that there's nothing left for Ash to do. He wouldn't be a Pokemon Master and since I can't see him defeating the Elite 4 and their Champion, let alone win the Unova League, he'll most likely continue traveling around to a new region regardless of where he places in a league. He clearly loves to explore new regions, catch and battle with new Pokemon and make new friends. That's why he still continued on after winning the Orange Island League and the Battle Frontier. I know that you said that those didn't count, but those were still major accomplishments and I still think that winning the Battle Frontier is just as significant as winning a league due to the prize the give out to the winners. Even if Ash wins a game related region league, I could easily see the writers make him travel around another region just because he wants to improve even more and get more Pokemon.
 
I think ultimately it would be a slap in the face to Ash's other Pokemon, TBH. Ash should take the rest of the region to prepare this team in the best shape possible. After he does this, then he can win next saga's League.

In terms of Ash winning a League at all, well, yes I've had my doubts, but I do think it's possible for him to win one and keep on going. He still should challenge the Elite Four and honestly, I dont see anything wrong or boring about Ash re-challenging every region with reappearances from tough foes and old friends.

BTW, what I meant when I said Ash seemed like Kanto was a region league win for him, I meant that based on it being his whole town, and a whole fairy tale ending concept, not based on his skills whatsoever, cause honestly, then Gary was more deserving he won 10 badges if I'm not mistaken.

Ash does deserve to be thrown a bone, but I would not like it if it was poorly written, I'd rather take my chances of Ash winning a league later on.

Also, Bel winning the League will be one of the hugest shockers ever haha
 
I'd honestly laugh if Trip made it to the finals. Not only because it would mean Ash would have to beat him, but also because a rookie like Trip would make it to the finals when neither Gary or Paul did.

Honestly its the lesser of two evils for me. Make Trip into a sue, as long as Ash wins the league I don't care.
 
Catwoman said:
BTW, what I meant when I said Ash seemed like Kanto was a region league win for him, I meant that based on it being his whole town, and a whole fairy tale ending concept, not based on his skills whatsoever, cause honestly, then Gary was more deserving he won 10 badges if I'm not mistaken.

Ash does deserve to be thrown a bone, but I would not like it if it was poorly written, I'd rather take my chances of Ash winning a league later on.
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Even if they had done something like that, it would have been pretty unrealistic given Ash's journey in Kanto, his battles in the league and even his reaction to training for the league. It just would be extremely unsatisfying to watch. Even though Gary won ten badges during Kanto, we didn't see much of his actual skills on screen and when we did finally see him battling in the later part of Kanto, his skills weren't that impressive to me. Though, to be fair, most of the actual battles in Kanto were pretty lackluster for the most part.

Catwoman said:
Also, Bel winning the League will be one of the hugest shockers ever haha
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I'm not sure if I could see Bianca winning the Unova League. Though, given her personality in the show and what happens to her character in the games, that would be pretty funny in an ironic way.

Gliscor'd said:
I'd honestly laugh if Trip made it to the finals. Not only because it would mean Ash would have to beat him, but also because a rookie like Trip would make it to the finals when neither Gary or Paul did.

Honestly its the lesser of two evils for me. Make Trip into a sue, as long as Ash wins the league I don't care.
Click to expand...

Trip going into the finals would make him feel more Gary Stu-ish to me, but it would just be a weak way to make sure that Ash got to the final round of the Unova League. Given what we've seen thus far, I don't think he's even ready for getting to the League finals. I honestly could see Ash going back to being in the Top 8 or if he drastically improves his training for his Pokemon in the latter half of BW, getting to the Top 4 again, but anything beyond that is pushing it. I still don't really see the appeal for Ash winning a game related region league. Yeah, it's be nice to see after so many years of following his journey, but it's not really something I hope for and if it was, I'd probably stop watching the show, or at least stop getting excited for the league matches. The main reason why I thought that he could win in the Hoenn and Sinnoh Leagues was because of how he trained his Pokemon and the impressive battles he had with most of the Gym Leaders, especially in Sinnoh. With BW, there's really nothing about Ash that could make me think that he could take the whole Unova League himself.
 
I just want some awesome, entertaining and well written 6 v 6 battles, using good varieties of Ashs roster. There was only one good Full battle in sinnoh so any more than that would be an improvement. If Ash makes it to the semis again ill be happy, but if he gets trolled again ill be pissed. I dont see him winning though
 
No. I think Ash will never win a league, sadly. What will happen to Ash if he wins the Isshu League? The writers would have to come up with a completely different and original story.
 
We'll know the answer to that question in another 3 years. A year and a half if BW makes Satoshi get another 4 badges in a year. The remaining half is for tournament stuff.
 
I'm not one of those who'll quickly pass off the idea of him winning a league ever, though that's not to say I expect him to. But as we're already halfway done with the required number of badges league entry, and considering the way his current team has been handled, I don't think it would be believable or satisfactory if he did bag first place. Especially if they tried to cram in some ham fisted poetics by having Shooty in the finals and having Ash be his obstacle in facing Alder. Yikes.

In any case, I don't think this (or at least him getting as far, or further than Sinnoh) is something that is easy to speculate. As Wolverine pointed out earlier in the thread, there really hasn't been too much in the way of rhyme nor reason when it comes to pretty much anything involving the characters developments in terms of battling. By all means, he shouldn't the way things are going, but I could easily see it happening 'just because', if that makes any sense.
 
Please note: The thread is from 14 years ago.
Please take the age of this thread into consideration in writing your reply. Depending on what exactly you wanted to say, you may want to consider if it would be better to post a new thread instead.
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