Has anyone ever been happy with how Ash has lost in a Pokémon League?

[Magmaster12]

So a while ago I decided to watch Ash's battle against Tyson the final battle in the Hoenn league and realized it was rediculas at the end of the battle pikachu only lost to Meowth because Tyson had it block pikachu's electric attacks with thunderbolt and the same thing with iron tail. One thing I don't get is why do the writers always have stupid ways of Ash loosing like in the indego league that battle ended in disapiontment they refused to let Ash heal his pokemon and I guess the Johto league was probably the best because its cool seeing two fire starters against eachother.

 

[Cybersai]

I don't really mind. I liked how Ash lost in all 3.

Charizard lost because Ash couldn't get it to obey him, which was a great plot twist since originally we all thought Ash would win his first league.

Charizard Vs. Blaziken was also well done, we knew he would lose but it was a good battle.

And Tyson's Meowth was much stronger than a regular Meowth, and I did like it how pikachu *almost* won since Tyson's Meowth looked like it was about to faint.

Here's hoping Ash wins the Sinnoh league.

 

[L-Z]

I wouldn't say that the writers have come up with "stupid" ways. Quite the opposite, really. It was quite realistic how it the Indigo League ended, seeing how Ash was just a beginner back then. And the Silver Conference and the Hoenn League also ended just as nicely, considering that all the battles were great. OK, I didn't like the Hoenn League that much, but it was all right. And I'm glad they didn't make Ash into a total Gary Stu.

As for the Sinnoh League, well, only time will tell. But I think Ash has grown to become a good trainer, so he should win already, then challenge the Elite 4 and lose to Cynthia, etc. And the story continues.

So, to answer the question in the thread title (I think it's a question...): Yes.

 

[JB88]

Either he wins or loses doesn't mean it's the end. I kinda wished he won in Hoenn.

 

[Cybersai]

If Ash doesn't win in the Sinnoh league, I don't know what to say. It would be like all the Elite 4 foreshadowing is for nothing.

 

[Lil Brother]

Kay, I got a question: back in Johto and Hoenn, did people believe that Ash would indeed win the league?

Anyway, I don't mind. Gotta keep the series running. And before anyone points it out, I don't need any new main character, thankyouverymuch.

 

[RJoshua]

I'm kinda happy about it, because it always gave Ash a reason to continue training. If he won any regional tournaments, what would be the point of competing in any more? Ash seems like the kind of person who would become arrogant over a victory in the league and not bother competing in any more.

That said, I'm with Scott about the Sinnoh League. Seems like the writers are building up to Ash winning the League, and then losing to the Elite 4/Cynthia afterward.

 

[swampertuska]

If Ash will win Sinnoh league and after then challenge Elite Four and win all of them he will I AM SURE OF THAT beat Cynthia once and for all.

He is only trainer who can do it. I'm sure of that not because i am fan and so on but because i belive in his Charizard. From the beginnig of pokemon series we saw how much progress he made. Charizard beat ARticuno (legenadry pokemon). He lost to Dusclops because of Ash's fault.

And I'm sure Charizard is the only one who can finally beat Garchomp.

 

[Cybersai]

Kay, I got a question: back in Johto and Hoenn, did people believe that Ash would indeed win the league?

During Hoenn we knew he wouldn't because the upcoming Japanese BF episode titles spoiled that he wouldn't.

We all knew Ash lost to Tyson because when the next ep has Ash back in Kanto, it was fairly obvious he wasn't going to win.

Anyway, I don't mind. Gotta keep the series running. And I don't need any new main character, thankyouverymuch.

We'll need a new character eventually. If the anime is still going in the year 2020, you might as well brand the whole thing as irrelevant because its impossible to maintain continuity at that length. And on top of that, rewatching the series will be near impossible with so many episodes.

 

[Trainer'sInsomnia]

I remember I hated how Ash lost to Harrison's lame ass. That was probably the only, if not, most upsetting win.

It was like, he displayed impressive strategic skills and strength as a trainer when he upsetted his long time rival in an epic wire, 6th-to-6th battle, surging into the final 8, only to lose to Harrison. All that intelligence he displayed when Charizard overcame Blastoise went where...? It just felt like the big hyped match that we saw the round before was for nothing.

And once again, Gary unfortunately became the subject of devaluation. This was corrected when it happened in the Indigo League, because Gary had that whole development as a character and trainer, and he proceeded to have his newly trained (as far as we know) Evee take down Pikachu. But then in the Johto Conference, we didn't have that same feeling of vast improvement.

And I still can't help but feel like that if Gary had gone through, he would've taken out Harrison.

I was overall disappointed with the Johto loss.

 

[Lil Brother]

During Hoenn we knew he wouldn't because the upcoming Japanese BF episode titles spoiled that he wouldn't.

We all knew Ash lost to Tyson because when the next ep has Ash back in Kanto, it was fairly obvious he wasn't going to win.

Yeah, but I mean during the story arc itself. I'm just wondering.

Also, to add on to an earlier point: Pikachu vs. Meowth was awesome, because... seriously, it's Pikachu vs. Meowth. That's just epic.

 

[Cybersai]

Yeah, but I mean during the story arc itself. I'm just wondering.

I do remember some people speculating he might of, because a lot of people thought he'd have Sceptile at the league, (haha, kind of like how people expect him to have Infernape but won't, anyone notice history repeating itself?), and had the most evolutions at that point.

Theoretically Ash could have won the Hoenn league and continued onto Battle Frontier anyway, I guess the writers felt though it was better to give him another loss. Ash managed to come in the Top 8 again but without using any older Pokemon, which is why it was an improvement for him as a trainer.

 

[Hector]

I thought the Kanto loss made a lot of sense. But like a lot of people have said, I thought Ash would have made it a lot further in the Johto league after that great battle with Gary. Maybe not win it, but definitely finish top four or make it to the finals. And I did think that he was going to make it to the championship match in the Hoenn league

So I guess the only loss I am happy with was the Kanto loss. Because I think Charizard should have beaten Blaziken (after all, he did have a type advantage) and I think that Pikachu should have beaten that Meowth...

 

[dman_dustin]

I'm not upset that Ash loses, I think it makes it more realistic but Ash should at the very least improve each time.

Kanto- Top 16 (Decent number for a beginner)
Johto- Top 8 (Improvement noted)
Hoenn- Top 8 (Well he did improve because he never used any of his veteran Pokemon except Pikachu so that's an improvement).

It would make sense for Ash to at least get Top 4 in the Sinnoh League, but I could easily see him getting higher than that. To be honest I'm not entirely sure I could keep watching the anime if Ash got Top 8 in the Sinnoh League. Because at that point Ash will never win a league, and I don't see Ash wanting to continue. Top 8 three leagues in a row, he might as well use his older Pokemon at that point.

So as long as Ash gets Top 4 in Sinnoh (or Higher) then I'll be okay if Ash loses.

 

[Trainer'sInsomnia]

Um, Hoenn may not necessarily be an improvement from Johto actually.

You guys must clearly be forgetting something:

The Johto Conference, from what we've seen of the final 16, was practically raped from trainers of other regions who used those Pokemon of their respective journies. At least, this was the case of Ash and Gary, with Harrison as no exception.

In the match between Ash and Gary, Ash may have used his classic line up, but Gary did too. Gary had a Scizor that had likely become that way in Johto (obviously), but Ash also used his Heracross and Bayleef, which were both from that region as well.

Then in the match against Harrison, Ash used 3 Pokemon from Johto (Totodile, Noctowl, Bayleef), and 3 of his earlier Pokemon (Pikachu, Snorlax, Charizard). Harrison used his starter from Hoenn (Blaziken) and Kecleon from Hoenn. I'm far too lazy to check the Dex on Hoenn, but we know that he had a newly caught Sneasel in Johto, a Houndoom likely from the same area, and a Steelix that was conceivably evolved there. Meaning roughly half of his Pokemon may or may not have been from the journey in his home region as well.

So the only rounds Ash used classics to overcome Johto-Specific trainers were his two early rounds. Other than that, his two important matches with Gary and Harrison were entirely even in terms of "classics" and "new additions".

Hoenn was not an improvement, because his line ups in Johto were relatively equal to those of his opponents, region-specific or not.

 

[Magmaster12]

Here the deal
I new Ash would loose the indego leage because when I saw it I new the series would go on I new he lost the johto legue because they aired advanced generation early and Max mentioned his charizard lost to blaziken same with the hoenn league we all new that he was going to challenge the battle frontier

 

[Zeta]

My problem isn't so much the losses, so much as:

1) He never gets far enough to make it a dramatic loss (like 2nd or 4th place)
2) The people he loses to are always bland Mary Sues without any interesting personalities.
3) It's generally anti-climatic.

 

[Cybersai]

2) The people he loses to are always bland Mary Sues without any interesting personalities.

Well thankfully they tend to be improving the "league rival" each saga.

Indigo: We get Richie. Basically what Ash is without any flaws. Generally considered the Mary Sue of Pokemon, Richie uses the same Pokemon as Ash yet somehow manages to excel in every area. Brock even said when he looked him on the computer how Richie "never had to switch Pokemon" or something to that effect. (Someone can dig up the exact line if they want)

Johto: Harrisson, an improvement over design on Richie. In terms of personality, not much, we just knew he came from the then hyped-up Hoenn region and had the "almighty Blaziken" at the time.

Hoenn: Morrisson had by far the most personality of all of Ash's league rivals. I often compare him to Yajirobe from DBZ, he was a funny rival who loved to eat and was competitive. By far my favorite of the bunch.

And then Tyson, who generally didn't have much personality beyond liking to eat at restaurants, but his Meowth had a nice backstory and a little rivalry with TR's Meowth.


Whatever the case, the league rivals have been improving with each passing region. For Sinnoh I actually think with Paul and Jun around, we won't get a new league rival because I'm hoping Ash wins so he can go on to the Elite 4.

Morrisson was my favorite of Ash's league rivals, I actually kind of wish he was Ash's full rival for the entire Hoenn region, he would have been the perfect rival that saga. Oh well.

 

[swampertuska]

I really want ash go to challenge Elite Four. Because I want to see a battle between Ash and Flint

 

[Aestivate]

I really prefer the fact that Satoshi has lost all of his major-league conferences up to this point. This gives him a lot of humility and focus. There's loads of proof how he has grown/is growing as a trainer and a person.
There's always boundaries to be broken, which what he'll try to achieve with the Sinnoh league, I guess.

The only things I have problems with is the overall rushed-ness of league battles, especially final ones. =/ Well, if the Mikuri Cup got 6 episodes dedicated to it despite only being a simple contest battle, hopefully Sinnoh's League Conference arc will exceed that by many grades.