How do you deal with official name changes?

[winstein]

(Skip to last paragraph if you want to get to the question of this topic)​

There are times when we would encounter name changes in a franchise, and that could be a tricky thing to deal with. For one, we are so used to the current names that we might prefer using them, so adapting to another official name change could be difficult. It could even result in people complaining about it, and they might still adapt to the old names, either out of habit or out of principle. Of course, there are others who would be happy to change the name usage, so it's not an entirely black or white issue. In any case, name changes catches people off-guard.

There are reasons official name changes occur, so it's not like the name changes are done for the sake of doing it. The most major reason name changes happen is to make a name universal from a previously regional name. Perhaps a certain character is famous enough that to make their name the same is to make it easier, or it could be to make porting into another language easier.

There are two cases with name changes that we will look into here: Princess Peach and Dr. Eggman. Obviously neither are Pokemon-related, but the attitude to their name changes are different and relevant to the discussion.

Princess Peach used to be called Princess Toadstool, which was used in all games before Super Mario 64 in other regions, except for one other game. Oddly enough, the Mario cartoons refer to the Princess as "Princess", which we could presume is Peach because Bowser is called "King Koopa". When Super Mario 64 referred to her as Peach for the first time, there does not seem to have a protest on her name. Probably the reason is that she is not a major enough character to be worried about, and change weren't quite opposable in 1996 (or that in said game, both names were used, even if Toadstool was used once only). The name Peach stuck, and there's no going back to Toadstool again.

Dr. Eggman is where the change is met with a more negative response. In Sonic Adventure, Eggman was the doctor's surname, to match the Japanese name. It used to be that he was Robotnik in other places, so the name change came off as sudden. It should be noted that Robotnik was used a lot before Sonic Adventure, so in the minds of Sonic fans, that was what he was called. It had gotten quite a lot of complaints that Eggman had to be called "Dr Ivo 'Eggman' Robotnik" so that it would please everybody. Personally I liked Eggman a lot more than Robotnik even if I knew of Robotnik the name first, but that's another story.

Now let's get back to Pokemon, because it is a subject on Pokemon after all. It should be noted that name changes do occur in Pokemon, but those are relatively minor as to not affect the grand scheme of things. For example, "ExtremeSpeed" is now "Extreme Speed", because the extra character limit makes a difference. Despite this, some people might still stick to the former spelling out of habit. There was also a name change from Lorelei to Prima at one time, but it is not likely to be remembered because it happened in an episode in the anime.

Interestingly, even if there are some name changes that should logically happen, namely "Feraligatr" and "Victreebel", it didn't happen even if we have "Fletchinder" (I suspect it could be shortened to Fletcinder if they want to). It would be interesting to see the fan response to a name change. If it's me though, I am less opposed to it because I actually prefer the wording to be correct.

That was a really long build-up, so let's get to the question to start this discussion! Here, I would like to ask you, how would you deal with the changes in official names if it were to happen? Would you be inviting to Tin Tower suddenly becoming Bell Tower all of a sudden, or that Gardevoir becomes Sirknight everywhere else? Or, in Japan, Meowth is the official name instead of Nyasu?

Thanks for reading.

 

[Hex Maniac]

Is there a reason why these names would be changed?

Names are changed a lot between the Japanese versions and the English versions for cultural reasons. Professor Oak's name in Japanese is derived from a family name so it probably doesn't sound so weird to Japanese people. I think Western fans would expect "Professor Orchid" to be a young man or a woman. "Oak" is more associated with an older, wiser person. The names of other professors, I think, are also tree-related in Japanese so Oak is more the exception than the norm. You also shouldn't forget that some languages have gendered words for plants, so in some languages "orchid" would be a feminine noun so it wouldn't work.

From what I know, the Princess Peach/Toadstool issue was due to translation. Maybe the translators at the time thought it sounded more magical but it was later decided to make it more uniform, since "Peach" sounds cute like her character design.

I don't understand why Feraligatr or Victreebel should have their names changed at all. It doesn't sound incorrect to me considering most pokémon names (in English) are not actual words but portmanteaus or altered versions of words, to evoke the general idea without just calling the pokémon by the name of what it resembles. It doesn't have to be a correct word.

 

[winstein]

Keep in mind that this topic is more towards your reaction if a name change were to happen, rather than an official confirmation that name changes will happen, especially when applied to more iconic characters.

Is there a reason why these names would be changed?

As I have said, there are a few reasons names could be changed (though I don't have them all). It could be that certain characters are deemed appropriate to receive a name change. In the context of Pokemon, official name changes that happened are minor. For one, an extended character limit gave way to a name change, such as SmellingSalt becoming Smelling Salts. In a more extreme move name example, there's the French name for Night Shade ("Ténèbres" becomes "Ombre Nocturne") since the former is the same word used for the Dark-type.

Just an example: what if Clefairy becomes Pippi because it matches its sound? While not the most agreeable reason there is, it's still a valid reason for the name change.

Names are changed a lot between the Japanese versions and the English versions for cultural reasons. Professor Oak's name in Japanese is derived from a family name so it probably doesn't sound so weird to Japanese people. I think Western fans would expect "Professor Orchid" to be a young man or a woman. "Oak" is more associated with an older, wiser person. The names of other professors, I think, are also tree-related in Japanese so Oak is more the exception than the norm. You also shouldn't forget that some languages have gendered words for plants, so in some languages "orchid" would be a feminine noun so it wouldn't work.

I agree that name changes happen to match the cultural perceptions of a region. This happens quite a lot, so it's something we are expected to see. You do have a point that using Professor Oak as an example of a name change isn't entirely appropriate because of this, though.

I don't understand why Feraligatr or Victreebel should have their names changed at all. It doesn't sound incorrect to me considering most pokémon names (in English) are not actual words but portmanteaus or altered versions of words, to evoke the general idea without just calling the pokémon by the name of what it resembles. It doesn't have to be a correct word.

It is certainly true that Pokemon names are portmanteaus, but there are some people who prefer the portmanteaus to be comprised of the correctly-spelled word rather than one word being of an improper spelling. In Feraligatr, for example, it is comprised of "feral" and "alligator". Seems simple enough, but it is actually comprised of "feral" and "aligatr" instead. The reason this name change could feasibly happen now is that the character limit of Pokemon names are extended, meaning that we could call it "Feraligator" or "Feralligator" if they want to. Victreebel follows the same premise. Claydol might seem like a spelling mistake because the latter sounds like "doll", but it is comprised of "clay" and "idol", so there is no problem here.

Thanks for reading.

 

[Karpi]

Hmm... for a personal example, Yukimenoko (Froslass) was one of the first 4th gen pokemon I learned about, and I immediately thought it was awesome (which it is) and incorporated it into the comic strip I was making at the time even though she had no English name yet. So I had tons of Yukimenoko written everywhere before we had the translated version. When that finally happened, I made sure to train a Froslass to use because I still thought it was cool, and her name was Froslass, but my comic strip character was still Yukimenoko because that was her name by that point.

So basically the two names mean different things to me now. When I'm writing fanfiction nowadays I just don't introduce pokemon without English names yet to avoid this situation in the future.

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Also, I 100% support Feraligator and Victreebell. Also, if there were no limitations on length, Girafarigirafarig.

 

[Stratelier]

(I suspect [Fletchinder] could be shortened to Fletcinder if they want to).

No, it would probably be "Fletchindr" (a.k.a. Feraligatr 2.0) or more likely "Flechinder" because if you drop the 'h' you change the pronunciation in a significant way. (If the old limit was 9 letters instead of ten, you wouldn't take the H out of 'Charmeleon' would you? Or the E. Or the O.)

The name changes we've seen are solely because the original was clearly misspelled (Faint Attack -> Feint Attack; homophones) or would've gone over the internal length limit by a space (ThunderPunch -> Thunder Punch). It's important to remember that Japanese has a much larger alphabet and can therefore spell many words in fewer characters than in English.

But as far as I'm concerned, some of the English names that need to be changed at some point:
- Tail Whip (as much as it sounds like a tail strike, the Japanese name is "Tail Wag", and the in-game descriptions support this, which casts a completely different picture of it)
- Meteor Mash (the 'real' Comet Punch. Seriously, why couldn't they call it "Meteor Punch" ?)

 

[Jukain]

This sort of thing has a long history in the fandom. It's easy to forget since now, having to deal with one language version coming out before the other is no longer an issue. We actually got to go into a generation seamlessly, without many issues about names. They still existed since the Japanese info would often come first, but it was revealed in English shortly thereafter, thus, no one had to get used to the names. I have been with the fandom since the third gen's development, and I have seen it happen 3 times over of everyone using the Japanese names and then the English names come and there is always the reluctance to use them until they become so commonplace that you end up using them anyway. I've even seen great amounts of ire over the name changes. Some people still complain about them, way after the fact. If you've been around long enough, you'll find that to be true anyway. This fandom does not like change. At all. One of particular note for me was HG/SS's decision to do the translation right this time and call what was the Tin Tower now the Bell Tower. However, I have known that place as the Tin Tower so long that I still call it that, even though I know of the translation error. Other than that, I honestly don't care about name changes since I know they're going to happen.

 

[Alpha71689]

This wouldn't affect me. How I derive enjoyment from Pokémon isn't centered around names.

 

[Drakon]

Honestly, I don't really care.

I'll just use whatever's cooler/more badass sounding.

 

[Silverwynde]

Sometimes I do grumble about it, if I'm used to the original Japanese name. But most of the time I start using the new one and it catches on with me, so I'm good with it.

 

[Enzap]

It wouldn't affect me that much in most cases. I'd probably just use the new version and not think twice about it, unless it was something very drastic. The whole Oak-->Orchid thing seems like a bit of an extreme example to me, and I highly doubt they'd change something like that at this point.

 

[Fairy Ice Ricky]

Based on my experience with Tin Tower/Bell Tower, I think I would just eventually get used to the change whether or not I liked it, simply because I wouldn't see the point in getting angry over something so small. (I'm in the camp that prefers Tin Tower, but whatever, Bell Tower works, too.

 

[Team Gaara]

The two notable examples you've included, Feraligatr and Victreebel, would bother me if they were suddenly changed. Despite all the "proper spelling" arguments, those are not the names of the Pokemon. I don't care if they were the intended English names had there been enough spaces, the names are Feraligatr and Victreebel, not Feraligator and Victreebell. I see no reason to "fix" the spellings when they aren't wrong.

Another debate I've seen in the past are people in favor of Blue's name being changed to Green, like he's called in Japanese, and I am against that, as well. Especially in the case of the Pokemon Adventures manga, where the debate is more severe with the character based on Leaf, called Green in English and Blue in Japan. I can't tell you how many times I've been called an idiot for referring to the girl as Green and the rival as Blue and being told that "I'm wrong" and "the translators made a mistake and mixed them up!" and "the boy is Green and the girl is Blue!" This is despite the fact that the reason for the name change in both the games and manga are perfectly legitimate and obvious and even the notion that there was some sort of mix up in translation is ridiculous. I don't care about the originals in Japan or the fact that we got LeafGreen. The rival's name has always been referred to as Blue, and I would be highly upset if it were suddenly changed to Green in English. Since we originally got Blue, I am in full support of the rival forever being called Blue in English media.

 

[Muur]

I bitch then get over it and go with the new names.

 

[AKluthe]

The two notable examples you've included, Feraligatr and Victreebel, would bother me if they were suddenly changed. Despite all the "proper spelling" arguments, those are not the names of the Pokemon. I don't care if they were the intended English names had there been enough spaces, the names are Feraligatr and Victreebel, not Feraligator and Victreebell. I see no reason to "fix" the spellings when they aren't wrong.

You could argue that "gatr" doesn't follow proper English formatting. It's highly unusual to not have a vowel in there, and the only reason there isn't one is because there's less space for names in the English versions of those games.

Plus, they're fictional animals. Nothing is cemented, things get revised in new games all the time; some pokemon have changed types. Some of them got typings that didn't previously exist.

 

[Team Gaara]

You could argue that "gatr" doesn't follow proper English formatting. It's highly unusual to not have a vowel in there, and the only reason there isn't one is because there's less space for names in the English versions of those games.

Plus, they're fictional animals. Nothing is cemented, things get revised in new games all the time; some pokemon have changed types. Some of them got typings that didn't previously exist.

Well, one of the reasons I'm so okay with the name not being changed is because they're fictional animals. The rules of English formatting aren't really relevant to me in a fictional world.

Type changing isn't as severe as name changing, in my opinion (even though this would be a minor change in the name). Type changing can happen because classifications for types can realistically change. For example, Magnamite's family being made of Steel. When there becomes a means to classify a Pokemon as the Steel-type, it makes sense that they could now classify that Pokemon as that type. A name, however is different, to me. It's the label by which a Pokemon is referred to, and once that name has been decided, regardless of grammar rules, it would just seem weird to suddenly change it.

I hope that makes some kind of sense~

 

[HyruleAlpha]

Don't care, to be honest. I don't get caught up in the small details.

 

[BlackButterfree]

Ugh, I'd hate that. There's a reason why the names were changed in the first place lol To make them unique to each language. I'll take Gardevoir over Sirknight anyday.

 

[Tsareena]

Hmm. It really depends on what would be being changed. If it's a Pokemon I'm really attached to, or a really important place or character in the series, I can see it having a bit of an impact. It would take some getting used to and would be a bit of a pain in the ass. If it's something simple like changing "Feraligatr" to fit in the new character limit I could live with that.