Ideas for future set-ups of main series games

[The Outrage]

I was quite pleased with the announcement of sequels, rather than a traditional third version, due to the rigid nature of the fandom. Speculation stopped being speculation, but merely "they did this before so therefore..." type conversations. Even now, when I look at people speculating on B2W2, some resort to wanting fake scans to speculate on real things, as if that's any different from free speculation. Really, are we unable to think for ourselves now?

And that's why I want to bring this topic back up again:

What do you guys think of a non-traditional set-up to the main series game?

Spoiler

I've gotten some interesting comments on my blog, particularly with regards to Chugoku and Shikoku. Maybe some people have given up on returning to Japan, but I doubt its the end we'll see of it, and these two regions provide an interesting set-up. Being geographically separate regions in real life, it allows for some of my suggestions in my blog and that thread, particularly, having two main versions that have separate (but related) stories.

This wouldn't be the first time we've seen different sides of the same story, as this was first done with Team Aqua and Magma. Emerald united those two stories, but what I propose is that one version start with Chugoku and the other version starts with Shikoku and will eventualyl allow you to travel between both areas. Each game will play independently of each other, but has an overarching plot, but told from different perspectives. It's a new way to tell a story, and would allow us to get more depth in the plot without bogging a single game with too many details.

I think this would also solve another problem this franchise has: useless opposite-gender characters. Ever since the option was created, choosing one gender either causes one to disappear entirely, or to stay in the side-lines. However, having two versions telling the same story from different perspectives allows for both gender counterparts to play a prominent role, by having the opposite gender counterpart to play the story you didn't choose.

Another interesting prospect with this set-up is that it allows for the plots to combine within the same games. In the LoZ:Oracle games, this was achieved through passwords, but Pokémon has been combining data through record mixing for a long time. Consider this however, if DLC becomes prominent, what if they allow for DLC to extend the post-game plot, but how the plot progresses in the DLC will depend on which game you choose to link with?

And finally, everyone complains that Game Freak and Nintendo are forcing you to buy the same games over and over. This time they'd be sufficiently different that it would be worth your cash to do so. Though, I wouldn't be surprised if people reacted negatively, given that a good portion of the fandom would rather have bought the same game twice (i.e. a third version) rather than a sequel

So what are your thoughts on this? How do you want future games to be set up?

 

[Beck]

I think the fake scans have become an insistent necessity only because we're so close to the game's release that the prospective features are narrowing down, meaning we have a very limited of idea of what we'll get, but just enough that random speculation (wishlists) is unfounded, so fake screens can provide a nice middle-ground. But at the same time, after such a curve ball with Black 2 & White 2's announcement I think it's fair to expect anything. The doors of possibility have been left open.

That being said I think anything being done to switch up the set-up for main series games could work nicely. I mean, honestly, because Black 2 & White 2 don't have a confirmed region just yet we could have two entirely different games, which further the differences between Black & White. I don't personally have any sort of preference, though, when it comes to future set-ups as long as Game Freak keeps delivering quality, well-thought and sensical games (well, as sensical as Pokemon can be).

 

[The Outrage]

How do fake scans provide a middle-ground between facts and baseless speculation? If anything, a lot of the fake scans seem more baseless and is just pandering to the creator's desires, so its honestly ridiculous for people to be demanding fake scans so they can speculate when they can already do that. It's as if people are afraid to think for themselves.

 

[H-con]

I really don't think DLC is the way to go for pokémon. I really don't think DLC would do anything better than third versions or sequels would do, and I really do think it's rather pointless (and besides I wouldn't touch a plot-related DLC for pokémon with a 10 feet virtual stick). Of course, I really don't like DLC, so that influences my opinion, and I really want pokémon to be the game that I can simply pick up and play without the worry of having to buy extra content. Just me though.

What I'd like is a game that didn't have gyms and a pokémon league, and exchange this method of progressing through the game with something else, if just for one game. By doing the gyms over and over again in game after game really narrows creativity and makes the game more linear than it should be.

Of course, a more realistic change would be a game world that you can at least influence somewhat. Actual side-quests that matters would help here, and make choices that can influence the game, if just simple ones (of course in pokémon, I reckon this would limit to pretty much a visual change, but it gives the illusion of choice).

 

[Matt_2_Sky]

I would like to see a MMORPG pokemon game where you can have seamless battles and trades with others. This idea is already being done in homebrews but it really needs the game developers to make it really great. It wouldn't involve collecting gym/badges, but a quest to keep the world safe both for humans and pokemon.

 

[The Outrage]

I really don't think DLC is the way to go for pokémon. I really don't think DLC would do anything better than third versions or sequels would do, and I really do think it's rather pointless (and besides I wouldn't touch a plot-related DLC for pokémon with a 10 feet virtual stick). Of course, I really don't like DLC, so that influences my opinion, and I really want pokémon to be the game that I can simply pick up and play without the worry of having to buy extra content. Just me though.

I actually only suggested DLC in light of what Nintendo is considering already, otherwise I wouldn't have bothered since I'm biased against the idea as well.

As for the non-gym progression, I think that goes in line with one of my other wishes--that Game Freak will consider making its own side-games to tie onto the main series.

 

[Garren]

Pokemon has DLC. All the Pokemon and C-Gears past out over Wi-Fi? That's DLC. Only difference is we don't directly pay for it.

 

[H-con]

I actually only suggested DLC in light of what Nintendo is considering already, otherwise I wouldn't have bothered since I'm biased against the idea as well.

Well, I wouldn't be too surprised if they did it, and it's just my personal bias against it that's acting out. To be blunt, it better be damn good if they do make some. If they make some visual changes or give what could be considered "unfair" advantages compared to not buying, then I would be royally pissed off.

Of course, that's just based on the idea that it's going to happen. I hope not, but time will show. (And of course, I'm talking about paid DLC, I'm okay with free downloads and events legendaries (at least for the most part).)

As for the non-gym progression, I think that goes in line with one of my other wishes--that Game Freak will consider making its own side-games to tie onto the main series.

I really don't want anything that could be considered as a side-game though, I would rather want a fully fletched main series game without gyms. The system with evil team, gyms and league should be changed, if just for one game, at least in my opinion. The notion that one kid should be able to save the world and pretty much every other character that should do something sits passive is absurd, and even in BW it's still lacking (Looker in Platinum is perhaps the best example of a terrible character like this, though I really, really, really hate him)
Whether or not the fanbase would consider that a main series game is rather irrelevant, I'm getting rather tired from certain parts of the fandom at the moment.

 

[Purellian]

Black and White are the first main series games that seem to kinda sorta maybe think about deviating from the traditional "become the champion" goal-based story line. I don't recall anyone really TELLING you to take the gym challenge, and it seems like it's much more Cheren's thing to do than yours. You just challenge the gyms because you seem to need to in order to progress, or because it's just a thing to do along the way. Your real goal is to stop N and Team Plasma from doing their Evil Thing. Later, you are invited to challenge the champion, seemingly as more of a thanks for the help and a recognition of your strength.

I think it would be super great if GF continued along this trend, making it more optional (or at least "optional-feeling") to take on the gyms and E4, while your real goal is to do something completely different. Maybe you've left town because a friend or family member went missing on their Pokemon journey, and you want to find them. Since this is a game for kids, the reason for them going missing doesn't have to be sinister, or no more sinister than what any of the evil teams have ever done, anyway. Maybe they've just gotten lost or distracted from their goals, and it's your job to show them what it truly means to be with Pokemon as friends and partners. This would be a story with depth and maybe even some twists and turns, but would still be appropriate and understandable by the kids playing as well.

What do you think?

Also, I like the idea of having the two games be very different, either with two different regions, or by having the characters start in two different "starting towns" and there being two routes through the region.

 

[Silktree]

I think it would be super great if GF continued along this trend, making it more optional (or at least "optional-feeling") to take on the gyms and E4, while your real goal is to do something completely different. Maybe you've left town because a friend or family member went missing on their Pokemon journey, and you want to find them.

I think that this should happen in B2W2, but it would require keeping Hilbert and Hilda as I described in my blog (or more specifically these two posts). I may be proven wrong soon enough, but it seems very likely to me that B2W2 will further depart from the badge quest formula than Black and White already have, and the best way to do that is by using protagonists who have an established story (and it helps that they've already collected badges). There might be new gyms and there will probably be rematches against the old ones, but that shouldn't be the quest. I don't find it necessary to resort to the term side-series for a game like this.

 

[Garren]

I wouldn't mind a more open-world, mission-based style of gameplay myself. Sort of like the optional quests in the Ranger Games, and I guess the High Link or whatever it was called missions in Black and White. When we first saw the CoroCoro scan with Hiun City, I remember a lot of people speculating it'd serve as a hub world and we'd travel to other areas from there. I wouldn't mind a game with that setup, with a large over-world to explore. I guess sort of a Monster Hunter style.

They could keep Gyms too, but make them non-linear and distributed across the land...like the levels and teams would change depending on what order you took them on, so each player would have their own "experience", so to speak. And as you explored, you'd unravel various plot threads that would grow into an overarching plot that you could take on at your own leisure.

 

[The Outrage]

I wouldn't mind a more open-world, mission-based style of gameplay myself. Sort of like the optional quests in the Ranger Games, and I guess the High Link or whatever it was called missions in Black and White. When we first saw the CoroCoro scan with Hiun City, I remember a lot of people speculating it'd serve as a hub world and we'd travel to other areas from there. I wouldn't mind a game with that setup, with a large over-world to explore. I guess sort of a Monster Hunter style.

They could keep Gyms too, but make them non-linear and distributed across the land...like the levels and teams would change depending on what order you took them on, so each player would have their own "experience", so to speak. And as you explored, you'd unravel various plot threads that would grow into an overarching plot that you could take on at your own leisure.

I had considered that a possibility for BW2 given the subway system, but I can see it being utilized in future games as well. It would certainly be interesting, and unites modern transportation along with traditional exploration. You can certainly still explore the surrounding areas.

Another possibility for a central hub may be a set-up I had been discussing with Silktree regarding time travel. With the sheer amount of event legendaries, I think we're due for some of them to lose that status. With that said, I don't think they should lose that status without being given something better in return. My idea is that Celebi could be used as a game's mascot, allowing you to explore different eras in the Pokémon world. There's a few we can examine right off the bat: Ecruteak before the Brass Tower fire, Alph before it was ruins, Relic castle, Cyrus as a kid etc.

 

[Beck]

How do fake scans provide a middle-ground between facts and baseless speculation? If anything, a lot of the fake scans seem more baseless and is just pandering to the creator's desires, so its honestly ridiculous for people to be demanding fake scans so they can speculate when they can already do that. It's as if people are afraid to think for themselves.

The scans were as baseless as any other form of speculation we've seen thus far. Pandering to a sole creator's desires or not, with the extremely limited information that we have right now anything is a possibility, as I know you and many others are aware of. The scans are a middle-ground between facts and baseless speculation because while they do comply with the fundamentals of Pokemon (the battle scenes, the Kyurems, the Sugimori artwork, for example) they also provide pleasant, visual speculation (such as the Cactowl, the clock tower, and the new protagonists). That's what makes the fake scans so appealing. If I were to describe a cactus owl to you all, it might very well sound like a good idea, but I have no proof and my idea has no merit. It's merely my speculation. But when someone can accurately fake what is expected from Game Freak, what we know to be fact (although all the while it is indeed fake), it gives us a base for discussion and further speculation. I don't think they're a necessity, the fake scans, but they provide a base to speculate from. Further, if I were to waltz into the Black 2 & White 2 thread with 'my very own' speculation, I would be swallowed, chewed out and spit off to the side, not only by the average fan boy but also by the staff, because we're at such a point in time where a wishlist no longer really cuts it, considering we all only know what Game Freak has done, not what they can do. That is why fake scans are a nice middle-ground, if you will.

It is also the quality of the fake scans that draws such a need. They look like what we're used to, feel like what should be expected, and seem to answer the questions we've all been asking. Now, why so many users are insistent upon getting more fake scans to talk about is somewhat beyond me, but probably due to the complete lack of information we have they serve as a pacifier. I don't agree with it either but it's what we've been given.

 

[smalllady]

How are fake scans the "middle ground?" Fake scans are just baseless speculation with pretty (?) pictures. Not really appealing to me.

 

[Purellian]

For me, the fake scans are a conversation point that gets everyone's attention. Right now in the BW2 thread, now that we aren't allowed to talk about the fake scans anymore, we've gone back to talking about our wishlists. It's still interesting, but you don't always actually have a conversation going on with it, because people tend to pass right over a lot of posts. That's the thing I like about the fake scans while we wait for the real ones. They generate real conversation that everyone seems to participate in, whether it's talking about how awesome they are, or proving them to be false, or discussing the good and bad aspects of the fake scans, that's an opportunity to interact with everyone else on the forum. I've been sitting here all day (because I have no life, of course) and the conversations are much less energetic now that there's nothing for us to rally around and talk about. Once the real scans come out, of course, there will be much more conversation, but in the mean time, some more fakes can't really hurt anything. I mean, these most recent ones were proven fake pretty quickly, so no harm done.

 

[The Outrage]

For me, the fake scans are a conversation point that gets everyone's attention. Right now in the BW2 thread, now that we aren't allowed to talk about the fake scans anymore, we've gone back to talking about our wishlists. It's still interesting, but you don't always actually have a conversation going on with it, because people tend to pass right over a lot of posts. That's the thing I like about the fake scans while we wait for the real ones. They generate real conversation that everyone seems to participate in, whether it's talking about how awesome they are, or proving them to be false, or discussing the good and bad aspects of the fake scans, that's an opportunity to interact with everyone else on the forum. I've been sitting here all day (because I have no life, of course) and the conversations are much less energetic now that there's nothing for us to rally around and talk about. Once the real scans come out, of course, there will be much more conversation, but in the mean time, some more fakes can't really hurt anything. I mean, these most recent ones were proven fake pretty quickly, so no harm done.

The fake scans were proven false before I went to bed. I woke up and people were still talking about them--something that's never been done before. The only difference this time is that the games are set up differently so people can't go around saying the same old tired argument that "this happened before therefore..."

I've been around the fandom long enough to know that how people are acting now, regarding fake information, is completely different from how they acted before. Rather than debunking something and moving on, people want fake scans, and they keep talking about them long after they've been proven false to the point of needing an intervention. Taking that option away, the conversation turns into speculations of when scans will come out so people can speculate, again needing mod intervention. All that's happening now is people are more willing to accept baseless speculation as long as it has pictures, because it takes the guise of "legitimate" information when there are many users who can, and do, post suggestions that are equally as good, or better. All it's saying to me is people can't think for themselves and would much rather talk about clearly fake information as long as it parades itself as real, than think about what others suggest.

Case point: This thread. The main purpose of this thread is to generate new ideas regarding how Game Freak can proceed in future games. The mentioning of fake scans was merely a framework to introduce the topic at hand: thinking up new ideas. However, everyone who's come to defend the merit of fake scans have taken to focusing on that rather than the actual discussion.

With that said, you can keep debating the merit of fake scans if you wish, but this isn't what this thread is about and I will no longer entertain such conversations.