Is Brock not entitled to the sweat of his own brow?

[PDL]

If you don't understand the reference in the thread title, please play Bioshock, it's a fun game.

Anyway, this topic asks this: Why do people want Brock to leave?

Yeah, he may be the least interesting main character (but still 10 times more interesting then Kenny lol), but he preforms very important problems and solves the plothole of how the main characters can survive at all in the wilderness they've been constantly wandering in for the past several months. Look at Team Rocket and how they struggle with day to day existance, would you want the same fate to fall on Ash and his friends?

He may be blandish as far as character development goes, but he's made himself indespensible because of these services. Plus breeding and raising your Pokémon is just as, if not more important then, battling and contests.

Replacing him with another character that essentially does the same job would also be meaningless since, well, he/she would be developed in the exact same way Brock would develop. Which would negate the reason to replace him in the first place. Also, characters can't be ready-made and be an instant success. They have to start from somewhere, which would bring us back to square one. Even Brock's lovelife gag started off normally in the first episodes of the anime. Forced gags are never ever funny.

So yeah, Brock isn't really going to go anywhere for a while

 

[Jnoo]

A tried and failed effort, which I would have no clue if it'll be successful again.

We can always get another one who's a little more interesting. =)

 

[PDL]

We can always get another one who's a little more interesting. =)

Pray tell, how?

 

[Jukain]

but he preforms very important problems and solves the plothole of how the main characters can survive at all in the wilderness they've been constantly wandering in for the past several months. Look at Team Rocket and how they struggle with day to day existance, would you want the same fate to fall on Ash and his friends?

They seemed to get along without him in the Orange Islands. I know Tracey is not the best example, but the point is that they did.

 

[RapidPotential]

Point is, the Orange Islands aren't a very big place like the regions of Kanto, Hoenn and Sinnoh are. They'd get by easily.

 

[anonymous920314]

But if Takeshi were to leave, you know that they would have an episode where Satoshi-tachi didn't know how to get along with out him and eventually found a way whether through calling him and taking advice or meeting someone new that could possibly travel along with him.

You have to remember that this show is written, and it's not as if the writers can't ignore things like that . . because they can. Just because if it were in reality that Satoshi-tachi wouldn't know what they're going to do, doesn't mean that in the show they wouldn't know what to.

 

[Cybersai]

You should check this thread, where this has already been discussed:

http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/showthread.php?t=24317

 

[PDL]

But if Takeshi were to leave, you know that they would have an episode where Satoshi-tachi didn't know how to get along with out him and eventually found a way whether through calling him and taking advice or meeting someone new that could possibly travel along with him.

You have to remember that this show is written, and it's not as if the writers can't ignore things like that . . because they can. Just because if it were in reality that Satoshi-tachi wouldn't know what they're going to do, doesn't mean that in the show they wouldn't know what to.

But then Ash and his friends would have to focus on self-care and survival, not on what the orignal purpose of the Pokémon Journey is: To train Pokémon. It'd be twice as much work for him and his friends. Also, the main selling point of the franchise is to showcase Pokémon, not how to survive in the wilderness.

Besides, real kids don't actually take care of themselves like that, so why should the kids of the anime?

You should check this thread, where this has already been discussed:

http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/showthread.php?t=24317

But mine has a clever title...

 

[Kewy987]

I like your thread too.

You're actually backing up your thread, which i love it when people do.

I also think Brock should stay, i don't see why he should leave. I love it when they have characters that aren't that well seen it the anime and how it surprises people later on in the most amazing way. I know there will be an episode all to Brock later on, after all, his Gregguru still has to evolve, and so does his Pinpuku, i'm actually happy that Pinpukku will be learning Refresh in the following episode.

 

[flyinglilypad]

Okay, who's dissing Brock? *gets out steel pipe* j/k. Anyway, yeah, Brock can cook and stuff. I like Brock, I think he's nice and take good care of Pokemon.

 

[Yotsuba]

But then Ash and his friends would have to focus on self-care and survival, not on what the orignal purpose of the Pokémon Journey is: To train Pokémon. It'd be twice as much work for him and his friends. Also, the main selling point of the franchise is to showcase Pokémon, not how to survive in the wilderness.

With all due respect, Pokemon NEEDS more story. Yes we love watching Satoshi and the others travel around and collect pokemon and badges/ribbons, but otherwise? WE WANT OTHER STUFF TO HAPPEN.

There's a reason we all go nuts over the evil organizations and such. Yes you can say "but in the games they don't have to worry about taking care of themselves", but so what? If there were actually scenes focusing on Satoshi trying to navigate his way out of a forest and use his head, do you really think it'd destroy the message of pokemon? If anything I'd think that'd promote pokemon even more.

Realistically people would use their monsters to navigate their way around, so why doesn't Satoshi? Why not build on the pokemon's personalities and abilities and use them to get around, locate food, and so on? Yes it'd widdle down the "character of the day" episodes, but so what? At least we might see some character development and expansion of the main group.

The only role Satoshi, Hikari, and their pokemon couldn't fill is the "this is what is happening" void during battles, but uh...why not use their zukans? They got those things for more reasons than just looking up pokemon every few days. I think many people would be much happier if Satoshi messed up in battle and Hikari got curious as to what happened and looked it up with the device she was given for that very purpose. Having Takeshi state the obvious works, but he just isn't needed.

Besides, real kids don't actually take care of themselves like that, so why should the kids of the anime?

Sorry for nit-picking, but...ah...how many real kids leave home at age ten either?

 

[PDL]

With all due respect, Pokemon NEEDS more story. Yes we love watching Satoshi and the others travel around and collect pokemon and badges/ribbons, but otherwise? WE WANT OTHER STUFF TO HAPPEN.

Oh sure, story is very important. However, Pokémon isn't actually a story driven anime, at least, not anymore. It's now mostly a vehicle to showcase the games and the rest of the Pokémon franchise. Plus it's mostly aimed at children who are 10 and younger. They like simple storylines and repitition.

There's a reason we all go nuts over the evil organizations and such. Yes you can say "but in the games they don't have to worry about taking care of themselves", but so what? If there were actually scenes focusing on Satoshi trying to navigate his way out of a forest and use his head, do you really think it'd destroy the message of pokemon? If anything I'd think that'd promote pokemon even more.

Realistically people would use their monsters to navigate their way around, so why doesn't Satoshi? Why not build on the pokemon's personalities and abilities and use them to get around, locate food, and so on? Yes it'd widdle down the "character of the day" episodes, but so what? At least we might see some character development and expansion of the main group.

Unfortunately, they won't have that since it pretty much never happens in the games. Pokémon was never ment to be a virtual pet game and never had a survival gameplay. It's always been solely focused on collecting and putting your monsters in competitions.

Raising and breeding your monsters however has always been an important part. Granted, it isn't as upfront as the actual competitions, but it still plays a vital role.

The only role Satoshi, Hikari, and their pokemon couldn't fill is the "this is what is happening" void during battles, but uh...why not use their zukans? They got those things for more reasons than just looking up pokemon every few days. I think many people would be much happier if Satoshi messed up in battle and Hikari got curious as to what happened and looked it up with the device she was given for that very purpose. Having Takeshi state the obvious works, but he just isn't needed.

You'd rather want a machine to replace a fully fledged character? Actually, that would be interesting for a bit... but it could get old really fast.

Sorry for nit-picking, but...ah...how many real kids leave home at age ten either?

There are plenty of runaways in real life. You'd be pretty surprised. (Although that's kind of a shitty example since every one of these kids end up being killed or something.)

 

[Piplup]

People are exaggerating with the "importance" of Brock's cooking and such
We got to see that Pokémon Centers give free food so they can easily take enough food with them from there... the only reason they don't do that now is because they have Brock
Orange Islands proved they can "survive" without him... I don't think every episode in OI Ash was about to die from hunger and I don't think OI changed the show from Pokémon to survival

They can easily remove Brock... the reason they don't do it isn't that he's important but they simply don't want to
So stop saying Brock is necessary - he's NOT
He's here because somehow the writers find him good enough to let him stay
Maybe they know a new sidekick will turn into nothing just like Brock so they don't bother

And the idea of the Pokédex explaining things is really good
DP60 proved you can point the Pokédex at a Pokémon using an attack and get the attack name and explanation
So the Pokédex clearly is capable of doing a lot more than what we know

The real problem here isn't Brock but the fact they writers don't know what to do with sidekicks
The heroes (Ash/May/Dawn) get all the spotlight while the sidekicks (Misty/Brock/Tracey/Max) do nothing
Maybe this show is better with a main group of 2 heroes only without sidekicks
But on the other hand maybe a group of 2 will be a little boring so maybe that's the only reason they keep a sidekick with them

 

[Zeta]

Besides, real kids don't actually take care of themselves like that, so why should the kids of the anime?

This isn't a real world. This is a world where fruit grows from "berry" trees everywhere, the crime rate is almost nil aside from some doofuses in jumpsuits, and people have sentient animals that obey their every command. I THINK they could get by.

He's here because somehow the writers find him good enough to let him stay

He's here because people complained so much about kicking him out for having squinty eyes back when the character was still interesting and not stale.

 

[Yotsuba]

Oh sure, story is very important. However, Pokémon isn't actually a story driven anime, at least, not anymore. It's now mostly a vehicle to showcase the games and the rest of the Pokémon franchise. Plus it's mostly aimed at children who are 10 and younger. They like simple storylines and repitition.

And that's why Bleach, One Piece and Naruto are really big.

Yes you may say these stories have repetitive moments, because they do, but come on...they all have definitely larger stories than freaking Pokemon, and I don't know any kids who whine about it.

Not to mention, you act like "since the story has no plot now, we aren't allowed to give it plot ever again". What the heck? Why not? If someone wants to come in and give pokemon an interesting storyline, they can. Nothing's stopping them.

Unfortunately, they won't have that since it pretty much never happens in the games. Pokémon was never ment to be a virtual pet game and never had a survival gameplay. It's always been solely focused on collecting and putting your monsters in competitions.

So? The original digimon game is very different from the anime, yet kids sure liked that. All the creators want is for the basic idea to still be there so it sells, after that? There's nothing wrong with adding stuff. The main plot still focuses on collecting badges and ribbons, kids are definitely going to buy the games. Making the story a little more deep will probably just add more interest.

Also, I don't remember the game ever focusing on romance, so I don't know how you explain Takeshi's obsession with it and the whole Contestshipping relationship. Focusing on love is taking away from the pokemon, it shouldn't have been there.

You'd rather want a machine to replace a fully fledged character? Actually, that would be interesting for a bit... but it could get old really fast.

Dude, it wouldn't always have to be the zukan. We do meet other characters when we approach gyms and contests, why not reuse them instead of making twenty characters we'll only see once? For example, have Shinji be there and say something, or maybe the gym leader since they kinda are your teacher?

There are plenty of runaways in real life. You'd be pretty surprised. (Although that's kind of a shitty example since every one of these kids end up being killed or something.)

Yes, there are runaways, but does our government approve of ten-year-olds leaving home to start their life? Heck, do you know any parents who would let their child do that even if the government allowed it?

 

[PDL]

Mind you, I'm not saying Brock is an interesting character now. (Though giving him quirky Pokémon helps a tiny bit.)

I'm just saying that he's dug himself into a postion that can't be replaced as easily as people say he is.

People are exaggerating with the "importance" of Brock's cooking and such

"People"? right now I'm the only one :\.

 

[flyinglilypad]

Oh sure, story is very important. However, Pokémon isn't actually a story driven anime, at least, not anymore. It's now mostly a vehicle to showcase the games and the rest of the Pokémon franchise. Plus it's mostly aimed at children who are 10 and younger. They like simple storylines and repitition.

;_; You make me feel stupid. Ah well, I probably am. ^_^

Yes, there are runaways, but does our government approve of ten-year-olds leaving home to start their life? Heck, do you know any parents who would let their child do that even if the government allowed it?

But they have tough pokies to protect them! That can tackle, and flame, and shock...and oh boy, I'd keep my kid in the basement in that world!

And the Pokemon Centers are only in the cities, some of the towns don't even have them. Plus, I thought only trainers who were undergoing serious training were supposed to use those for food?

And the Oragne Islands seemed pretty isolated and safe to me. Like Hawiie or something.

 

[PDL]

And the Pokemon Centers are only in the cities, some of the towns don't even have them. Plus, I thought only trainers who were undergoing serious training were supposed to use those for food?

It's never been stated just how many Pokémon Centers actually exist in the world, or where they all are.

Alot of them appear to be smack dab in the middle of nowhere, they're placed where ever the hell the writers want simply for plot convenience.

Which is probably the core reason why Brock is still around. Sure it's possible to implement all those ideas everyone wants, but it would be terribly inconvenient for the writers to have to divert from advertising to solve plotholes of Brock's absence.

 

[Cybersai]

I'm just saying that he's dug himself into a postion that can't be replaced as easily as people say he is.

PDL, the writers can do whatever they want.

They just keep him around because they're too lazy to introduce a new sidekick that might fail like Tracey did.

 

[Piplup]

"People"? right now I'm the only one :\.

Others said that too in previous threads

And the Pokemon Centers are only in the cities, some of the towns don't even have them.

And that's why I said they can -take food with them from there- and not that they should eat there and go

Plus, I thought only trainers who were undergoing serious training were supposed to use those for food?

So Ash and May did serious training in AG 2 ? don't think so
It's food free for everyone
I think in this episode Ash even said something like that to May: "you can eat as much as you want for free"

Also they can easily buy food (they obviously buy food currently off screen because the food don't come to Brock from nowhere) that they don't need to cook and eat as it is
Or after so much time Ash might say he learned from Brock or even have Brock teach him to do so before he leaves
Or again just like how they were in OI without him...

So stop this food thing
Pokémon isn't about food -_-
And AGAIN OI proved we can without Brock
The only "necessary" things are a hero for gyms and heroine for contests

fail like Tracey did.

Stop with that stupid and not logical rumor
When Tracey's first episode aired the writers obviously already start to write Johto and probably even the first episodes were already made
So there's no way they could do things by fans' reaction
Also from his first appearance Tracey made it clear he joined Ash and Misty only to meet Oak so why would he stick with them instead of staying with Oak? they probably planned from the beginning to have him stay there