Japanese Culture Edits

[Geoffrey]

This has been bugging me for a while. Why is it that when a dubbing company edits Japanese cultural references out, people throw a hissy-fit? The only people who have the right to be upset about it would be the natives of Japan, but they don't really watch dubs since dubs are foreign. Why is it that Americans feel offended by this when it has absolutely nothing to do with them?

 

[llxwarbirdxll]

Sometimes, rice balls are not supposed to be called sandwiches.

 

[Geoffrey]

Sometimes, rice balls are not supposed to be called sandwiches.

And that matters... how exactly? I'm not trying to come off as elitist, but the only people who should feel offended by that would be Japanese natives.

And another thing. This also happens in video games. Phoenix Wright is a good example of it. Yet, no one complains, at least from what I've seen.

 

[Kasumi]

If they're editing out Japanese references when the series are taking place in Japan, then I think people have the right to complain about it.

 

[Geoffrey]

If they're editing out Japanese references when the series are taking place in Japan, then I think people have the right to complain about it.

Why do you think that? I mean, if you're American, why would you feel offended that a Japanese reference was edited out?

 

[Kasumi]

I wouldn't feel offended. But if I'm watching a series that's supposed to take place in certain country, I wouldn't want the cultural differences to be edited out. That's like watching a movie that takes place in New York and having the Statue of Liberty edited out, for example.

This is one of the reasons why I prefer subs to dubs. They even add "translation" notes and such.

 

[Geoffrey]

I wouldn't feel offended. But if I'm watching a series that's supposed to take place in certain country, I wouldn't want the cultural differences to be edited out. That's like watching a movie that takes place in New York and having the Statue of Liberty edited out, for example.

But would it affect your enjoyment of it so much that you would whine and complain over such a small matter? When these edits happen, people act like it's a serious matter and get all riled up over it. It just seems ridiculous. I could understand a Japanese person being offended/disliking it, but an American? I know that people have personal preferences and all, but when people whine and complain over such a minor detail, sometimes I wonder if they're being serious or if they're just complaining for the sake of complaining.

 

[Perxio]

Eh, I'm bothered when the Japanese are bothered. Haven't seen that yet, so yeah.

I think for a lot of the younger fan(atics), they try to jump into the bandwagon or blow up their own ego by bitching about this stuff- feel like they're standing up against an unspeakable injustice made by "the man". I've seen these kids.

I see where the people who aren't the ditsy "omgsokawaiiadfgjdesunekosdafshit" are coming from with this. No real reason to edit the culture references out. I never noticed the couple that were left in the show when I was a kid, and it didn't bother me. I know the riceballs weren't sandwiches or donuts or icecream, nor did it make kids go apeshit trying to figure out what the heck they truly are. We were interested in the show. I, anyone I knew, and probably many or most other kids had never thought once about any of the culture references. So it's a waste for them to edit it, but it's also a waste for people to pitch too big of fits over it when it's not getting in the way.

So...it DOES bug me that it's pointless. I hate pointless things. I understand dub edits. I don't get this. But it bugs me even more when they nitpick paint edits. It's pointed out so much that I don't resent the edits, but the people who regularly moan over them (usually just the fantards, there's only one or two people with sense that make me want to bash my head against a wall more about it). So to most of the English-speaking or any other non-Japanese viewers who are insulted by the edits, I say "screw'em". To the Japanese, who are the ones who I also find should be the ones to be offended or not: alrighty if I could I, too, would do away with the edits. Whoot.

 

[Kasumi]

It would affect it to a certain degree. It's not something vital, but it's also annoying to see dub companies edit out things without any reason. Or to make it "americanized".

 

[Crankyman]

Warbird's statement makes it clear. If the edit is going to be absurd, shoddily done, or very noticable in any other way, then it isn't going to be something fans will enjoy as much, and detract from the viewing experience. Some edits are fine, such as some english text edits. But some are pretty bad, like passing off onigiri as donuts, sandwiches, and so on.

 

[Dual]

I make this post in reference to 4kids, since they are the main antagonists in this issue.

My problem with removing Japanese cultural references is that they do so (By their own admission, mind you.) simply to make it more marketable. They care nothing for the artistic integrity of the creator, or original production team, and their only concern is making a quick buck. The result is that series which were originally meant for teenaged audiences like Yu-Gi-Oh! and One Piece are watered down to the point where the things that made them popular in Japan to begin with (And thus made the appealing to translation companies in the first place.) are completely lost simply to make the series more suitable for nine-year olds.

tl;dr-> It pisses people off because it ruins the anime by making it more childish simply so that they can make more money off of it.

 

[vee2x_paradox]

Games like Phoenix Wright don't have characters with specific nationalities or cultures. One is case-only character that they gave an American name but kept everything else relating to his Japanese heritage left alone. And another big thing is the Fey/Ayasato clan characters. Although they are obviously of Japanese ancestry and their tradition of female spirit mediums, it can be easily translated into the American sense without much confusion or that big of a difference. Not only the characters but the various pop-culture jokes that Americans won't get until they are converted into their proper localized versions.

So it depends to an extent. If it has to be done for something major such as to prevent a lost in translation like editing a sign or changing a reference, that's fine. But editing out a whole character or censoring something major to a plot because it's not "American" enough when it can be easily changed a bit is another.

 

[Geoffrey]

Warbird's statement makes it clear. If the edit is going to be absurd, shoddily done, or very noticable in any other way, then it isn't going to be something fans will enjoy as much, and detract from the viewing experience. Some edits are fine, such as some english text edits. But some are pretty bad, like passing off onigiri as donuts, sandwiches, and so on.

I can understand how people can feel annoyed by that, but people seem to like making a mountain out of a molehill about this. Is it crucial that they be referred as onigiri/riceballs and not as donuts or sandwiches? Does it affect the plot at all? And there's also digital editing. I remember 4kids using this a bit in Pokemon and it was done quite well (in my opinion at least), and guess what? People whined, complained, and bitched about it.

tl;dr-> It pisses people off because it ruins the anime by making it more childish simply so that they can make more money off of it.

Wait, it's childish to say that a rice ball is a donut or to edit a rice ball into a sandwich? I can understand your point if you were just talking about the gun edits in One Piece, but in general? I don't think that would work. And who cares if Sanji is sucking on a lollipop or smoking a cigarette? Oh wait, don't answer that. I'll just get mobbed by fans.

Games like Phoenix Wright don't have characters with specific nationalities or cultures. One is case-only character that they gave an American name but kept everything else relating to his Japanese heritage left alone. And another big thing is the Fey/Ayasato clan characters. Although they are obviously of Japanese ancestry and their tradition of female spirit mediums, it can be easily translated into the American sense without much confusion or that big of a difference. Not only the characters but the various pop-culture jokes that Americans won't get until they are converted into their proper localized versions.

One could possibly argue that it's pointless to make Phoenix Wright take place in Los Angeles for the American version. One could also argue that it's pointless for the translators to have changed Maya's craving for ramen into a craving for hamburgers.

So it depends to an extent. If it has to be done for something major such as to prevent a lost in translation like editing a sign or changing a reference, that's fine. But editing out a whole character or censoring something major to a plot because it's not "American" enough when it can be easily changed a bit is another.

Unfortunately, people would still complain.

 

[Habunake]

It wasn't done quite well. It was tacky and obvious when a square shaped sandwhich bounced down a hill.

 

[Geoffrey]

It wasn't done quite well. It was tacky and obvious when a square shaped sandwhich bounced down a hill.

It seemed more rectangular to me. I probably need to see the episode again. There was also another time where a sandwich was edited in, but I never saw that episode, so I can't comment.

 

[Dual]

Wait, it's childish to say that a rice ball is a donut or to edit a rice ball into a sandwich?

When said edit is simply for the sake of dumbing down the series for children, then yes, I consider that childish.

Since you seem to like asking "What's the big deal?", then let me ask you this: Why did they feel the need to edit it in the first place? Why not simply translate onigiri to rice ball, instead of turning it into a completely unrelated food?

 

[Geoffrey]

Why did they feel the need to edit it in the first place?

Perhaps it's because they had to? Why do you think the Safari Zone episode wasn't aired? 4kids aired their shows on local cable, which means that things like guns and cigarettes are big, big no-nos.

Why not simply translate onigiri to rice ball, instead of turning it into a completely unrelated food?

1. They're dubbing it so they can do whatever they want essentially.
2. Pokemon is a show that's aimed at kids. Are kids REALLY gonna be missing out on something like calling a rice ball a donut? Are they going to sit there thinking for hours about what it was? No, of course not. They most likely won't pay it any mind and keep watching the show.

 

[Perxio]

2. Pokemon is a show that's aimed at kids. Are kids REALLY gonna be missing out on something like calling a rice ball a donut? Are they going to sit there thinking for hours about what it was? No, of course not. They most likely won't pay it any mind and keep watching the show.

I'd like to back this up as true. I was the right age at the right time of the "fad era", so just about everyone I knew never noticed these things- and strangely enough, I had a lot of friends back then, none of which anything like me, and have grown up completely different as well ("goths", the teenage moms- I remember one well, a "sk8tr", etc. it wasn't just me or anyone else prone to these things). Believe me, we. were. obsessed. I have nearly every episode up until the Johto seasons etched into my brain- mostly images, because shit that's how I think. Nothing ruined the show for any of us when they were pushing the show and games like it'd save their skins.

I would love for there to be a survey done, with a reasonably large size of fans who were kids at the time the show/game was a fad and insanely popular- OUTRIGHT insanely popular; I know it's very, very popular still, but it's not pressed NEARLY as much- and see how many actually noticed the edits.

 

[Dual]

1. They're dubbing it so they can do whatever they want essentially.

And that's the problem. They're completely ruining respectable series (I'm speaking in general here, not simply Pokemon.) simply to meet their own greedy ends.

2. Pokemon is a show that's aimed at kids.

And what about all of the other series, like One Piece or Shaman King, which were meant to appeal to not only children, but older students as well?

 

[Geoffrey]

I never noticed the edits that were made. In fact, I didn't even know that it was made in Japan. Of course, I was only nine at the time.

And that's the problem. They're completely ruining a series respectable series (I'm speaking in general here, not simply Pokemon.) simply to meet their own greedy ends.

As far as I know, they only ruined One Piece. The rest of their dubs are still going strong. And what do you mean greedy? They practically spend tons of money on the pointless edits that they make. I will admit, 4kids made a lot of pointless edits. However, complaints about these are just as pointless.

And what about all of the other series, like One Piece or Shaman King, which were meant to appeal to not only children, but older students as well?

Has there been such an instance of Japanese food being Americanized?