Kanto and Johto's neighboring regions

[Silktree]

Until recently, most fans had expected the tradition of the main series' regions being based on Japan's prefectures would be continuted in Generation V. We have been foiled in this expectation by a short remark made recently:

The Isshu region, the stage of these games, is a land far, far away from the Kanto and Johto regions with a totally different flavor. Surrounded in greenery is a giant modern city with nature and humans coexisting, as well as many Pokémon living there that have never been seen until now.

And thus, now there are debates going on as to which real-world country should be featured next. But that is not the subject I'd like to discuss in this thread, as I actually don't find it very interesting. Instead, my question is this: Will we ever be introduced to the regions that border with Kanto and Johto?

These regions clearly do exist, and yet have been obscured for years. It is obvious that Game Freak used Hoenn and Sinnoh, which are based on Kyushu and Hokkaido that are isolated from Japan's mainland (Honshu), because they wanted to depart from Kanto and Johto and thereby make the return to those regions more worthwhile. It could that in Game Freak's conception of the Pokémon world, all the regions based on Honshu share the same Pokémon League (Indigo Plateau's Elite Four), and there are only a few differences in the ecology (the variety of species). From what we've seen, Kanto, Johto and the Sevii Islands have Generation I and II species spread across them, with Pokémon from other regions being a rare sight to behold (although that may change in a few years after the Generation IV timeline due to the migration that is gradually taking place).

Of course, Kanto didn't always have Generation II species, and that only started to change towards the end of the Generation II timeline (beginning with the Sevii Islands). It is thus highly feasible that there are unseen species in the regions surrounding Kanto and Johto. But perhaps Game Freak feel that the familiar species have to be prevalent in those regions, as is the case for the Generation I Pokémon in Johto. If so, this may not be compatible with what Game Freak have in mind for new generations; it seems likely that Game Freak don't want to repeat what happened with Generation II where the new Pokémon did not stand out as well as they should have.

If my assessment is correct, there is still a way to get past this obstacle. What I propose is that the remaining regions be featured in some other way. What does that entail? Either being used as a secondary region in the new games (akin to Generation II's Kanto, but also to FRLG's Sevii Islands and DPPt's Battle Zone), or serving as the primary setting of secondary games (akin to remakes, but obviously still new games that would simply not be branded as a new generation). The appeal of those regions would be to expand the mythology and characters of the country based on Japan, while not treading the same terriories and stories of past games.

What I am most curious to see is the region lying north to Kanto, where the Sinjoh Ruins are located. If there is any story that has been known of for years and yet nothing concrete is actually known about it, it is the story of the Unown. Even though this could be previously extrapolated by the Crystal references and the appearance of Unown in the Sevii Islands and Sinnoh, HGSS have spelled out the reason for why the mystery is currently unsolvable: There is more to the Unown than the Ruins of Alph and Johto. In the past, the Unown lived with "relatives of humans" (I'm using the game's wording) in the Ruins of Alph. At some point in history, the ones who wished for the Unown and humans to again coexist were forced to leave to protect the Unown, and we now know where they went: the mountains where they built the Sinjoh Ruins with help from the people who had built the Spear Pillar.

What I am getting at is that there are still untold stories pertaining to the four known regions, and in particular to Johto; it is clear that remakes aren't the means for answering those mysteries. As far as brand new adventures and characters are concerned, the proximity to Kanto and Johto is irrelevant, so Isshu won't feel very different from Hoenn (unless there are going to be drastic changes to the formula). While I can understand why Game Freak want to move forward to unfamiliar territories, I do wish they could bring some closure to the series, rather than revisting it in almost exactly the same way. Even if they opt to to show us Hoenn and Sinnoh again via remakes, I don't see HGSS as the final say on Kanto and Johto; I believe that we need to see the other two regions for that closure.

 

[shinysharpedo]

Summing it up, you think that Isshu is right above Kanto and Johto, the sinjoh ruins will be throughly explained, and we can go back to the other regions? No critisism but that's the idea, right?

 

[coolking503]

There is a whole pokemon world. THey can make the new region anywhere they want, and sav space for next time. Eventually, they may run out of space and go north, however it seems that is where almia, fiore, orre, etc are, and it would make no sense if a region was surrounded by places with no new pokemon, but it has new pokemon.

 

[Silktree]

Summing it up, you think that Isshu is right above Kanto and Johto, the sinjoh ruins will be throughly explained, and we can go back to the other regions?

That's not very close to the point I tried to put across. The official web site has made it all but too clear that Isshu is going to be far away from Kanto and Johto, and there is no reason not to take their word for it (although there is a remote possibility that they are exaggerating).

I don't know when the Ruins of Alph and Sinjoh Ruins will be explained, but the dialogue in HGSS heavily suggests that it will happen eventually: "Unown, the Ruins of Alph, and Arceus... The mystery deepens... It has made me even more inquisitive! I will one day solve all the mysteries!" I suspect that the region of the Sinjoh Ruins will never be the center of a new generation for reasons I've already described, but it could still be used as a secondary region or as the center of secondary games. I wish that that region had been used instead of Kanto in HGSS; I prefer FRLG to HGSS in that they added the Sevii Islands rather than just a few locations and a glimpse of another region.

There is a whole pokemon world. THey can make the new region anywhere they want, and sav space for next time.

Explain what will be different next time. At this rate, Generation VI may very well be set in the same country as Isshu or in yet another new country.

Eventually, they may run out of space and go north, however it seems that is where almia, fiore, orre, etc are, and it would make no sense if a region was surrounded by places with no new pokemon, but it has new pokemon.

Until Game Freak reference any of those regions, they don't impact anything and can't be considered as part of the main series. Myself, I'd like to think that Orre is part of the area west of Johto, and that Gateon Port is based on Hiroshima. But Fiore and Oblivia are islands, which rules them out from consideration, whereas Almia may be part of the same island as Sinnoh, but is more likely to be unrelated. We have definitely yet to see what lies beyond the Kanto mountains, outside the Sinjoh Ruins.

 

[Tiki Man]

Well there's always a chance we could see more of japan being used if they ever decide to make remakes of RSE or eventually DPPt.

 

[Silktree]

Well there's always a chance we could see more of japan being used if they ever decide to make remakes of RSE or eventually DPPt.

I mean no offense, but that is a little short-sighted; I really don't see why new regions should play second fiddle to old ones, and Game Freak's track record with remakes indicates that nostalgia would be bound to take its toll on potential remakes.

This thread is meant for thinking outside the box. As such, I'm going to steer very far in my speculation as to the structure of Generations V and VI; if anyone takes issue with being a little imaginative, I suggest they stop reading. To start with, Generations III and IV differed from their first two generations in that they also had remakes, rather than just a third version; it is a fact that Game Freak altered the generational structure once. I am bothered by the sheer number of people who think that Game Freak have "nailed" just the right formula; there is always room for improvement, and I believe that there is another change coming our way in Generation V.

We could have gone back to Kanto and Johto in any number of ways, but we got remakes because the first two generations had been rendered completely obsolete by the loss of compatibility. Now, there are people who think that Ruby and Sapphire are headed in that direction, but the fact of the matter is that they will always be somehow relevant due to compatibility. Should they be downloadable games for the 3DS, this will be true even more so. More importantly, if Black and White feature Hoenn, only few players will complain about missing out on the first Hoenn experience. Plainly put, Black and White can be played on the DS and DS Lite, and so can the Generation III games. This is almost entirely akin to the the situation with Generations I and II, although the gap is much longer this time around.

Now, the first Generation VI entries will almost surely be playable on the 3DS, and so will the Generation IV games. What I am proposing is that the center of the main Generation VI games be yet another foreign country (not the same country Isshu is part of), with Sinnoh added at the end to give the games a familiar touch. Again, it would be akin to Generations I and II, only with a longer gap in between. There was no story link between Hoenn and Sinnoh because of the remakes; it would have been repetitive to see two sets of games (from the same two generations) complete each other. But now that is about to change, and linking Isshu to Hoenn (in a different way from Johto and Kanto's geographical proximity) would do both regions justice. That could also be the case for the Generation VI region (Russia-based?) and Sinnoh.

Kanto and Johto may or may not be visited again, but they should always be relevant, or the remakes will have been a waste. The first 3DS versions should be based on Tohoku; one premise would be to make all of the Pokémon from Generations I, II and IV available without relying on the Generation IV games (Generation III would have been taken care of by Black and White, which would make sense considering that that generation has been somewhat neglected in the current DS games). But the prime focus would be Generation V critters deliberately made unavailable in Black and White. How many of them there would be is immaterial at this point; we would not be dealing with a whole new generation, but there would be new version mascots, many evolutions of old Pokémon (of which there are probably going to be very few in Black and White) and an event legendary akin to Arceus. These Pokémon would make the new region stand out from the others, and their absence from Black and White would not detract from those games; they would be able to be traded there eventually, as was the case with the 185 Pokémon missing from Ruby and Sapphire at first.

Generation VI would follow this formula, only this time using Chugoku and and Shikoku. The prefectures above Kanto and Johto would probably be better assigned to Chugoku than to Tohoku; I think that the Sevii Islands should be used to expand Tohoku, especially since I feel that all Generation III elements should be brought back in Generation V (including Orre). It should also be taken into consideration that Generation VI's second pair of games will most likely be released in 2016, if not even later, marking a very good time (the franchise's 20th anniversary) for a return to Kanto and Johto.

Will this be the end? I certainly wouldn't mind it, but I am not going to venture too far into the future; I've already pushed it quite a bit.

 

[d.aisuke]

I have a few ideas for how this could work, but I"ll elaborate a little later.

In the meantime; Isshu is a very small area, and they need to be expanded it some way.

Touhoku is a canidate, but not the best choice as it will probably be short changed because it's not the main area.


Black and White should feature Houen, and in time travel is a major element in Black and White, Houens past should be explored.

Touhoku will appear as a new game, some 1-2 years after Black and White.
The Touhoku game will work as an entirely new game, and take the place of remakes.

The main goal of said game would be to spotlight the History and mythology of the region, with the connections to Jouto being fully explored.

Pokemon wise, around 50-100 new pokemon will be introduced, that are compatable with, but unobtainable in Black and White.
Those Pokemon should include

• Starter Pokemon

• Version Mascots

• new pokemon related to the Shinou Myths (Specifically Arceus and the Unown)

• New Pokemon related to the Joutou Myths (specifically the Beasts)

• A few of the regional archetypes

• A few common pokemon

• Pokemon related to or in the evolutionary families of "old" Pokemon (Generation 1-4)
  

Essentially, a new generation, without being a new generation.

Mechanics should remain the same as Black and White, though features from DPPt and HGSS should return
(example, the Poketch or Pokegear in stead of a new navigational device)

 

[DCM]

in all honesty, i don't see this thread going anywhere. you're speculating, and even then, theres nothing really to discuss, especially not here. if you wish to talk about isshu, we have a forum.

if you disagree with the locking of this, please PM me.