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Moves-of-the-Week Discussion #87: Return and Frustration

Winterdaze

Winterdaze

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In Pokémon, there are lots of different moves used by different Pokémon. Every week, we shall focus the discussion on a different move, and there will be some base questions that would help you start this off. This week, Return & Frustration are chosen.

In Generation 2, Friendship was introduced. (By the way, it's not happiness, as some places still call it.) Because of this, there should be moves that are affected by the value, to give it more use besides evolving Pokémon. Both moves are functionally identical, save for a certain interesting thing. The interesting thing about both moves are that they are more powerful the more or less the Pokémon likes the trainer, so Return is strongest with a maximum Friendship value, while Frustration is best with a minimum Friendship value. This move is easily learned by almost every Pokémon, so there won't be a shortage of users.

Here's the in-game description for both moves:

Return (XY) said:
Type: Normal (Physical)
Base Power: Varies
Accuracy: 100%
PP: 20

A full-power attack that grows more powerful the more the user likes its Trainer.
Click to expand...

Frustration (XY) said:
Type: Normal (Physical)
Base Power: Varies
Accuracy: 100%
PP: 20

A full-power attack that grows more powerful the less the user likes its Trainer.
Click to expand...

Here are the usual possible questions about this move:
  • How does certain Pokémon (who knows it) use this move? What kind of purpose would this move have for them (in the Pokémon World)?
  • How could this move be used to aid a profession in the Pokémon World?
  • Could this move realistically be used by any Pokémon who doesn't learn it normally? If yes, please explain your choices.
  • How would this move be used in battling, realistically or video game-wise?

Other questions (You could ask other critical questions beyond the listed):
  • Due to the ease on gaining friendship points on Pokémon as compared to losing them, Frustration is not easy to power up. How does one make full use of Frustration?
  • Note that Buneary and Lopunny are the only Pokémon to learn them naturally. Why are Buneary and Lopunny compatible to Frustration and Return respectively?
  • Would Return find use on any Pokémon without a Same Type Attack Bonus (STAB) on this move?

Here is the current user for Return:
(Level-up)​
  • Lopunny

    (Technical Machine 27)
  • (Every Pokémon with general TM Access)

Here is the current user for Frustration:
(Level-up)​
  • Buneary

    (Technical Machine 21)
  • (Every Pokémon with general TM Access)

Thanks for reading, and happy discussing!

~ The General Pokémon Forum Staff


Previous Move-of-the-Weeks:


For every four weeks, users get to vote for the next Move-of-the-Week. To narrow down the selection of potential moves, a criteria for the next move would be placed. If you want to vote, at least contribute to the topic in hand (because this topic is about the current move, not about voting for the next move). If you posted just to vote, your vote won't be considered.

One more thing: if a move is already covered in a past Move-of-the-Week, then it won't be considered, so make sure to check the list to see if the move you wish to vote had already been covered.

Criterion for next move: Counterpart Moves (Examples below)

- Reflect & Light Screen
- Roar & Whirlwind
- Flamethrower & Fire Blast
- Ice Beam & Blizzard
- Fire Punch, Ice Punch & Thunder Punch
- Sacred Fire & Aeroblast
- Roar of Time, Spacial Rend & Shadow Force
- Fusion Flare & Fusion Bolt
- Blue Flare, Bolt Strike & Glaciate
- Electro Ball & Gyro Ball
- Sunny Day & Rain Dance
- Sweet Kiss & Lovely Kiss
 
Note that Buneary and Lopunny are the only Pokémon to learn them naturally. Why are Buneary and Lopunny compatible to Frustration and Return respectively?
Click to expand...

My guess is that it's because they're based on real rabbits. Rabbits are prey animals, so they're always scanning their surrounding environment in case of danger. This causes them to become easily over-stressed, and thus possibly overwhelmed by anxiety and frustration. Buneary's ears are always rolled up (from BW dex entry), which means Buneary are always prepared to strike at any given moment. They're likely straining themselves like that, so it's natural that Buneary learn Frustration by level up.

While Lopunny are also very cautious rabbits, it is important to note that they are evolved forms. They're bigger and stronger than Bunearys and have better senses so they probably don't need to constantly scan the area. The dex entry in Pearl version says that Lopunny never fail to groom themselves - this meaning they can afford to stop looking around once in a while to groom their ears. So unlike Bunearys, they aren't over-stressing themselves. Also, from what bulbapedia says, Lopunny may be based on the Holland Lop - which are known for their sweet temperament and nonaggressive behavior (wikipedia). This meaning, they are friendly creatures, so they'd learn Return easily.
 
In my play through of X, I used an Aurorus with Refrigerate and Return. So yes, I think it's a very useful move that I still use and that got me out of so many tricky situations. I can't help but imagine Ostario squashing enemies to protect me.
 
Dark Chocolate said:
Note that Buneary and Lopunny are the only Pokémon to learn them naturally. Why are Buneary and Lopunny compatible to Frustration and Return respectively?
Click to expand...

My guess is that it's because they're based on real rabbits. Rabbits are prey animals, so they're always scanning their surrounding environment in case of danger. This causes them to become easily over-stressed, and thus possibly overwhelmed by anxiety and frustration. Buneary's ears are always rolled up (from BW dex entry), which means Buneary are always prepared to strike at any given moment. They're likely straining themselves like that, so it's natural that Buneary learn Frustration by level up.

While Lopunny are also very cautious rabbits, it is important to note that they are evolved forms. They're bigger and stronger than Bunearys and have better senses so they probably don't need to constantly scan the area. The dex entry in Pearl version says that Lopunny never fail to groom themselves - this meaning they can afford to stop looking around once in a while to groom their ears. So unlike Bunearys, they aren't over-stressing themselves. Also, from what bulbapedia says, Lopunny may be based on the Holland Lop - which are known for their sweet temperament and nonaggressive behavior (wikipedia). This meaning, they are friendly creatures, so they'd learn Return easily.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's that complicated. As I see it, "Return" is simply your reward for getting your bunny mon to level up via happiness sooner.
 
garrison-san said:
Dark Chocolate said:
Note that Buneary and Lopunny are the only Pokémon to learn them naturally. Why are Buneary and Lopunny compatible to Frustration and Return respectively?
Click to expand...

My guess is that it's because they're based on real rabbits. Rabbits are prey animals, so they're always scanning their surrounding environment in case of danger. This causes them to become easily over-stressed, and thus possibly overwhelmed by anxiety and frustration. Buneary's ears are always rolled up (from BW dex entry), which means Buneary are always prepared to strike at any given moment. They're likely straining themselves like that, so it's natural that Buneary learn Frustration by level up.

While Lopunny are also very cautious rabbits, it is important to note that they are evolved forms. They're bigger and stronger than Bunearys and have better senses so they probably don't need to constantly scan the area. The dex entry in Pearl version says that Lopunny never fail to groom themselves - this meaning they can afford to stop looking around once in a while to groom their ears. So unlike Bunearys, they aren't over-stressing themselves. Also, from what bulbapedia says, Lopunny may be based on the Holland Lop - which are known for their sweet temperament and nonaggressive behavior (wikipedia). This meaning, they are friendly creatures, so they'd learn Return easily.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's that complicated. As I see it, "Return" is simply your reward for getting your bunny mon to level up via happiness sooner.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but then Lucario doesn't learn Return by level up, or Togetic.
 
Dark Chocolate said:
garrison-san said:
Dark Chocolate said:
Note that Buneary and Lopunny are the only Pokémon to learn them naturally. Why are Buneary and Lopunny compatible to Frustration and Return respectively?
Click to expand...

My guess is that it's because they're based on real rabbits. Rabbits are prey animals, so they're always scanning their surrounding environment in case of danger. This causes them to become easily over-stressed, and thus possibly overwhelmed by anxiety and frustration. Buneary's ears are always rolled up (from BW dex entry), which means Buneary are always prepared to strike at any given moment. They're likely straining themselves like that, so it's natural that Buneary learn Frustration by level up.

While Lopunny are also very cautious rabbits, it is important to note that they are evolved forms. They're bigger and stronger than Bunearys and have better senses so they probably don't need to constantly scan the area. The dex entry in Pearl version says that Lopunny never fail to groom themselves - this meaning they can afford to stop looking around once in a while to groom their ears. So unlike Bunearys, they aren't over-stressing themselves. Also, from what bulbapedia says, Lopunny may be based on the Holland Lop - which are known for their sweet temperament and nonaggressive behavior (wikipedia). This meaning, they are friendly creatures, so they'd learn Return easily.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's that complicated. As I see it, "Return" is simply your reward for getting your bunny mon to level up via happiness sooner.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but then Lucario doesn't learn Return by level up, or Togetic.
Click to expand...

True, I don't know why the rabbits were singled out in particular, but Lopunny's pokedex entries simply don't support the idea that it is any happier or less aggressive than its pre-evolution (it's repeatedly described as a highly cautious pokemon that will kick violently if handled too roughly), so I suspect that it's largely arbitrary. The best argument to the contrary, as far as I can see, is that it relates to the species' trait of responding badly to rough handling, but that behaviour hasn't yet been linked to its pre-evolution. It seems to me that Lopunny is the more highly-strung of the two (the fact that it levels up via happiness not withstanding).
 
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I'm very more curious as how the attack move would look like realistically. It's a physical contact move so
I imagine the Pokemon tackling the opponent with great force and the power depends on how deep their bond is with their trainer.
For frustration, I guess the more bitterness the Pokemon has in his/her emotions the greater power its move would be.
Cos I wouldn't see the point of how the Pokemon would obey or fight for its trainer when it has 0 happiness to it.
 
cityvillain said:
For frustration, I guess the more bitterness the Pokemon has in his/her emotions the greater power its move would be.
Cos I wouldn't see the point of how the Pokemon would obey or fight for its trainer when it has 0 happiness to it.
Click to expand...

As I see it, it's taking its anger out on the opposing pokemon.
 
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