Question about Zinnia and Aster ~ MAJOR SPOILERS

Morgil

Morgil

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So at one point during the Delta Episode, i noticed Zinnia called her wismer "my daughter". Then, during the confrontation atop Sky Pillar, she talks about stuff she did in the past "with Aster", and then mentions that "I still lost her", and "I want to see her... I want to be with her again... My sweet Aster...".

Soooo... was there another Aster? Could it have been her daughter? Just how old is Zinnia, anyway?
 
Steven refers to Zinnia as a woman so I guess she's just young-looking.
 
One of the grunts thinks that Zinnia is a teenager: "What’s going on with you and that girl from earlier? I know teenagers can feel frustrated, but that’s no reason to go wrecking other people’s hideouts. What’s that? You’re not together? Sorry about that."

But that's just an impression based on her appearance; Steven knows more about Zinnia from her grandmother. Regardless of her age, I highly doubt that the original Aster was her daughter:

Zinnia said:
Ever since I was a little girl, I have always turned my eyes up to the sky. When I was so full of uncertainty that I felt my heart might be crushed by it... When I was so grief-stricken and alone I thought my heart might break of it... What about you? Have you ever had to do something like that?

... I used to watch the stars like this all the time... Together with Aster. We were always together. In good times and in bad. But I still lost her.
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It seems pretty clear that Aster was her childhood friend. Zinnia felt grief-stricken even as a child, so Aster probably died when Zinnia was young.
 
Considering Zinnia's personality, I wouldn't be surprised if she only called Whismur her daughter because sometimes when Whismur speaks it says "mum"
 
To me, that just seemed like somebody referring to themselves as their pets' parent. It's a fairly common thing that people do, at least where I live, to impose a sort of "familial relationship in spirit" on a pet.

As for the original Aster, it could be anyone. A sister, or maybe a mentor, or just a friend or a girlfriend. I suppose she could also be Zinnia's daughter, although personally I think Zinnia looks quite a bit on the young side, so if Aster were her daughter, then she must have died at a very young age.
 
The more interesting question is how Zinnia intends to reunite with Aster:

Zinnia said:
I want to see her... I want to be with her again... My sweet Aster... I will, won’t I? With this... Just a little longer...
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Did she think Rayquaza would help her find Aster? That's unfeasible unless Aster didn't actually die. Or did she simply mean that if she could save the world as well as the other world, she would at least have a chance to find Aster? That doesn't really explain the "just a little longer" part, though.

It should be noted that Zinnia destroyed the dimensional shifter, so if the Aster she wants to find is in the other world, it's unclear how she plans to end up there. Seeking Hoopa is an option, but again, she she seemed to think that she was already on the verge of achieving her goal, only to realize that she needs more time: "I think I’ll spend some time now trying to find out if it’s also possible to forge a new beginning for something once lost."

There is also another oddity about Zinnia:

Who am I? That’s a surprisingly difficult question. ... I couldn’t become who I was supposed to be, so who does that make me now?
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She said this when she was still a successor, so isn't it an odd thing to say? Just who was she supposed to be? Could it be that she had to fill in for Aster?
 
Endolise said:
To me, that just seemed like somebody referring to themselves as their pets' parent. It's a fairly common thing that people do, at least where I live, to impose a sort of "familial relationship in spirit" on a pet.
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Must be a regional thing, cuz i sure as hell never heard anyone call a pet their son or daughter. It just seems creepy and weird.

Also, to the post right above me, can you please use spoilers on unrevealed pokemon? I started reading your post, then noticed a certain word a few lines down and immediately scrolled away in a panic before i could see anymore.
 
Morgil said:
Also, to the post right above me, can you please use spoilers on unrevealed pokemon? I started reading your post, then noticed a certain word a few lines down and immediately scrolled away in a panic before i could see anymore.
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I didn't say anything about the Pokémon itself.
 
Silktree said:
The more interesting question is how Zinnia intends to reunite with Aster:

Did she think Rayquaza would help her find Aster? That's unfeasible unless Aster didn't actually die. Or did she simply mean that if she could save the world as well as the other world, she would at least have a chance to find Aster? That doesn't really explain the "just a little longer" part, though.
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If you want to look on the darker side of things maybe Aster did die and Zinnia didn't intend to live much longer. It's possible she intended to finish her quest before reuniting with Aster but interaction with you gave her hope to keep continuing with her life.

Morgil said:
Must be a regional thing, cuz i sure as hell never heard anyone call a pet their son or daughter. It just seems creepy and weird.
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Not that strange to me. Considering a pet is a small creature that needs to be looked after it can be easily compared to a child. My brother referred to his dog as his son until he actually got a son.
 
Steel_Justice said:
Morgil said:
Must be a regional thing, cuz i sure as hell never heard anyone call a pet their son or daughter. It just seems creepy and weird.
Click to expand...

Not that strange to me. Considering a pet is a small creature that needs to be looked after it can be easily compared to a child. My brother referred to his dog as his son until he actually got a son.
Click to expand...

Normally, it's heard the other way around, if that makes more sense. Typically women who own pets refer to themselves as the pet's mother or "mama", rather than saying the pet is their child. So it does come across a bit strange that Zinnia called Aster her daughter instead of just calling herself "mother", which would have been a bit more normal.
 
Silktree said:
She said this when she was still a successor, so isn't it an odd thing to say? Just who was she supposed to be? Could it be that she had to fill in for Aster?
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Didn't she say that after she failed to bond with Rayquaza though? Technically it wasn't her fault but she still didn't become who she was intended to be--the person to bond with Rayquaza and save the world. That's 2000 years of Lorekeeping leading up to this day that they foretold.
 
Team Gaara said:
Steel_Justice said:
Morgil said:
Must be a regional thing, cuz i sure as hell never heard anyone call a pet their son or daughter. It just seems creepy and weird.
Click to expand...

Not that strange to me. Considering a pet is a small creature that needs to be looked after it can be easily compared to a child. My brother referred to his dog as his son until he actually got a son.
Click to expand...

Normally, it's heard the other way around, if that makes more sense. Typically women who own pets refer to themselves as the pet's mother or "mama", rather than saying the pet is their child. So it does come across a bit strange that Zinnia called Aster her daughter instead of just calling herself "mother", which would have been a bit more normal.
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Zinnia is hardly normal so it's still a possibility.
 
I like Zinnia. she may have done some bad things, but she had good intentions. As for Aster, I felt that she needed to be remembered in some way, so I named one of my MANY Rayquaza's after her. I feel bad for Zinnia. you could easily tell she was hurting when she talked about Aster (whoever that was). what I'm wondering is why she named her Whismur 'Aster'. was it so she would have some sort of memory of the real Aster? or for some other, different, reason?
 
shay2345 said:
I like Zinnia. she may have done some bad things, but she had good intentions. As for Aster, I felt that she needed to be remembered in some way, so I named one of my MANY Rayquaza's after her. I feel bad for Zinnia. you could easily tell she was hurting when she talked about Aster (whoever that was). what I'm wondering is why she named her Whismur 'Aster'. was it so she would have some sort of memory of the real Aster? or for some other, different, reason?
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Okay, now I'm wondering if her Whismer really is Aster, or at her reincarnation. It's either that, or Zinnia's friend got turned into a Pokémon somehow, and she's trying to figure out a way to reverse the process. If it's the latter, then maybe she should go pay a visit to Bill in either Kanto or Johto.
 
She basically leaves Whismur twice (once on Sky Pillar, and again in Mt Meteor) so I doubt it
 
I admittedly only finished the Delta Episode last night (darn other commitments), but here's my interpretation of Zinnia and Aster:

I thought it was made rather clear that Zinnia either expected or outright intended to die following her summoning of Rayquaza, which was prevented by Rayquaza's weakened state and the player character's meteorite. With the way she spoke of Aster, I thought it was fairly clear that she is deceased and that the Whismur was named in her memory.

As for the "daughter" remarks, my older brother and his wife refer to their pet gerbils as their children (which extends to calling me their uncle and my mum, their grandmother). It could just be as simple as that.

There is a possibility to put on the table though - that Zinnia and Aster were lovers. At one point in the Delta Episode, I remember Zinnia outright saying that she loved Aster and of course, the word "love" can be interpreted in many ways and I'm very interested in knowing what Zinnia said in the Japanese version, but I have noticed that OR/AS has featured a fair few possibly romantic female NPCs (the girls in Sea Mauville Room 2, the Ace Trainer in Mauville etc), so maybe it's possible?
 
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I was super confused at first when she was talking about Aster when it was right there next to her but then I realized the Whismur is just nicknamed after the real Aster.
Apparently some people believe Aster was Zinnia's daughter since she refers to Aster-the-Whismur as "my daughter" but I'm pretty sure she means it in the same way people refer to their pet as their baby. While Steven does call her a "woman" she really looks rather young... like older than the player probably but still young. So I doubt she had a kid already.
I'm more willing to believe Aster was a close friend that either died or drifted away from her one way or another. Assuming Aster really did die, that makes sense of why Zinnia was so sensitive towards the non-mega universe's fate. She may have been worried about the other world's Aster's fate, considering that Aster could still be alive.
I also wonder if Zinnia would now try to find a way to crossover into that other world to meet the other Aster and be with her. Although that may result in the awkward situation of two Zinnia existing in the same world, or even the total bizarre idea of having to fight her own alternate self over Aster's attention.
I really wish we could learn more about her, but sadly that's probably gonna be left for our imagination forever.
 
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