The TouchScreen and all of it usability.

[Flame_]

Well the touch screen was introduced on the DS/DSi and for Pokémon that meant things like the Pokétch and using your Pokédex. Just how exactly is the touch screen, do you think is going to be utilized in Generation V, besides using attacks? What will it do? Will it be absolutely useless? Thoughts?

 

[XD375]

I hope whatever use it has isn't required unless it's a mini-game.

 

[Falconwing]

It was used a lot for HGSS... now if only it would be used to actually use the attacks, not jsut to select them.

 

[TheSkull]

I hope whatever use it has isn't required unless it's a mini-game.

Then get a Gameboy Advance. Honestly, the point of a DS is the touch screen.

Give us a classic DS RPG where you move with the stylus.

 

[GreatLiver]

Keep all controls exactly like they were in DP. No moving with the stylus, or using it to aim attacks. Keep it simple. Playing the games would be much more annoying if you had to constantly be watching what you're doing. D-Pad control all the way.

 

[RudolphMilotic]

Then get a Gameboy Advance. Honestly, the point of a DS is the touch screen.

And the point of a Wii is the pointing and motion sensor controller (aka the Wii Remote), yet Masahiro Sakurai choose not to use both features in any fashion for Super Smash Bros. Brawl.

Honestly, I don't know why people want the touchscreen to be implemented in every aspect of the game. This isn't Phantom Hourglass or the Ranger titles, it's a Pokémon main series game. The argument of "DPtHGSS didn't exploit all what the DS has to offer" is lame and pointless, because they are RPG games with a focus on the battle system, not the story. Maybe it seems as I'm contradicting myself, giving that I was a supporter of Generation V being developed for the DS successor, but the thing is that I don't want brand new games for the same old console, with not many actual new things to offer.

 

[Falconwing]

What does story have to do with the touchscreen? If anything, the touchscreen is a perfect tool for the battling system.

Also, GreatLiver, do you realize how many awesome games are out there that require you to pay attention 100% of the time? Your logic is rather flawed.

 

[GreatLiver]

Except I'm not a fan of those games? I mean like that indeed counts for something when it comes to my personal opinion I should think. I like the fact that if i'm hanging out with people and casually playing pokemon, I can ignore it for a few minutes to do something else, and come back and not have ruined something. Plus, requiring that I pay attention while battling would deter from the amount of time I play pokemon, since a good portion of that involves myself being mildly inebriated.

 

[Hector]

Something I think would be cool for the next gen games is if they use the touchscreen for battles. What I mean by this is that you can actually affect the battle with a series of touch commands. If you've ever played Paper Mario or The Sonic the Hedgehog RPG for the DS, you know what I mean by touch commands.

Anyways, these commands would increase your success in battle, helping improve accuracy, chance to crit, and inflicting status (depending on the attack)

I know it would be a major change, but done right, I think it would be cool.

 

[RudolphMilotic]

What does story have to do with the touchscreen? If anything, the touchscreen is a perfect tool for the battling system.

A perfect tool no, because the battle system of Pokémon is mainly turn based, with no interaction from the player once a move is chosen. If they allow input from the touchscreen then even more random variables will be taken into account to determine the output damage and side-effects, which will have an impact on how the current 'competitive' metagame works and would make the system even more complex to handle. The same goes for breeding. The touchscreen would be, however, 'perfect' to advance through the story, as they can use it to make the game character move, use HMs on obstacles, draw objects, use elevators and tools, etc.

 

[Falconwing]

A perfect tool no, because the battle system of Pokémon is mainly turn based, with no interaction from the player once a move is chosen. If they allow input from the touchscreen then even more random variables will be taken into account to determine the output damage and side-effects, which will have an impact on how the current 'competitive' metagame works and would make the system even more complex to handle. The same goes for breeding. The touchscreen would be, however, 'perfect' to advance through the story, as they can use the touchscreen to make the game character move, use HMs on obstacles, draw objects, use elevators and tools, etc.

Um, in case you missed it, they've been changing the metagame every generation. In gen II they introduced two new types. In Gen III they reworked the EV and IV system and introduced abilities. In Gen IV they split attacks between physical and special. So how is utilizing the touchscreen going to be any different?

 

[GreatLiver]

Um, in case you missed it, they've been changing the metagame every generation. In gen II they introduced two new types. In Gen III they reworked the EV and IV system and introduced abilities. In Gen IV they split attacks between physical and special. So how is utilizing the touchscreen going to be any different?

All others are based on the game, your suggestion is based on player input.

 

[Falconwing]

All others are based on the game, your suggestion is based on player input.

So? Got any ideas on how to improve the game aspect? Cause I'm at a loss as to what would make the battle system as it stands better.

 

[RudolphMilotic]

In gen II they introduced two new types. In Gen III they reworked the EV and IV system and introduced abilities. In Gen IV they split attacks between physical and special. So how is utilizing the touchscreen going to be any different?

All of those things you mentioned were mere updates necessary to enhance the battle system and make the training of Pokémon easier to keep track of, not to make it even more complex. Let's see:

-New types: They were just that, new types. Overhaul to the type-chart but nothing else. Did they actually do something other than bringing balance to the Psychic-type prevalence?
-EVs and IVs system: Dragonite had a maximum attack of 366 in Crystal and Yellow, and a maximum one of 367 in RSE/DPt with a neutral nature. EVs have a cap of 65536 in RBYGSC for every stat and a maximum of 510 for all stats (255 in one stat) in RSEFRLGDPtHGSS, but of course that had to be done giving that the equations deliver almost identical values but are different (and the Game Boy Advance can handle more bits). IVs in RBYGSC range from 0 to 15 (with each one representing two points less from the stat formula at level 100) but 0 to 31 in subsequent games. Yeah, they made much more complex the damage calculation[/sarcasm].
-Abilities: Now Gengar is immune to Ground-type attacks, the same as if it would have had the Flying-type. Merely extra effects in battle to help some Pokémon cover weaknesses or have an extra edge in battle and nothing more.
-Physical and Special classification: This one is ridiculous, because they were already special and physical attacks in the first place; the only difference is that now each move is put in one or the other category. Major change from old-versions programming-wise? I don't think so.

-Reading and interpreting data from the touchscreen: Chatot's signature move, Chatter, has the side effect of confusing the opponent, and the percentage of it happening is calculated based on input from the microphone, with an already semi-complex formula that Game Freak had no other option but make the attack actually exclusive to it to avoid errors in battle if someone tried to copy the attack. If they take liberties to implement the touchscreen in battle, some mechanics such as evasiveness would have to be rewritten from scratch and the system would receive a major, major revision to determine the accuracy of the attack and how much output damage the opposing Pokémon would receive.

Equations used in Pokémon to randomize and calculate the success of random and side-effects happening are somewhat complex, did you know? And not only that, but it would detract many fans from the series, known mostly for its take on strategy and prediction and not from deep interaction.

 

[Falconwing]

I did know, but I think you are downplaying some things.

TYPES: Oh wow, Psychic isn't in charge any more. Huh gonna need to rethink my strategies.

EV's/IV's: Okay, so now I'm gonna be spending hours to breed and get them jsut right and I need to plan ahead for this.

Natures: ... Um, yeah, how were these not significant. Hitting an Ampharos is now the equivalent of receiving a free thunder wave, effectively cutting your speed and thus ruining your sweeper.

Physical/Special Split: Certain Pokemon are now more useable because they have attacks that take advantage of their stats. Remember Gyrados? Remember how it used to suck with water attacks? NOT ANYMORE!

Everytime this happened, strategies had to be rethought, new pokemon added to lineups, tiers changing. You may blow them off as not being important or significant but every change to the battle system was crucial to hard-core metagamers. But how can they improve now? What can be added? By utilizing the touchscreen... you know, the key component of the DS... you are once again changing the strategy. And I'm not saying we're going full 3D real-time here. I'm saying you use the touchscreen to aim attacks, try to avoid, etc. That's improvement. It is still turn based, but now requires more skill, strategy, and luck, the three components that prove who really is the best. Sure some fans will hate it. Fans always find something to complain about. Fans hated the pokemon following you feature, even though NO ONE had an issue with Pikachu in Yellow. And it was simply an aesthetic thing with no effect on gameplay whatsoever.

And yes, I know it's complex. Hasn't stopped all those other highly successful DS games that are full 3D real-time.

 

[RudolphMilotic]

And yes, I know it's complex. Hasn't stopped all those other highly successful DS games that are full 3D real-time.

3D is easy to implement. Writing code to manage events in real time and reading values when there's already many variables to include and analyze (3D fighting games or MMORPGs don't take into account so many things) is, however, by no means a 'piece of cake'.

And it would not require more skill and strategy but rather luck and good reflexes, two things I would hate seeing (and many others, mainly the hardcore metagame players) even more in the battle system.

In regards to the other things you said, apparently you didn't understand what I was trying to explain.

 

[Mijzelffan]

Not more than they use it now.

 

[SaintDynamite]

Revamping the turn-based battles in such a way is contradictory to the very essence of Pokémon. You (the trainer) tell the Pokémon what to do. You don't then perform the move for it.

How would this translate to a Wii version of the game? I may be nifty at using the old touch screen, but not so much with the Wiimote.

Battle interaction could, if the designers had wanted it to, been introduced to the series at any point. We've always had buttons, just like how the oft-quoted Paper Mario/Mario & Luigi games use buttons for their action commands. If Gamefreak had wanted anything besides turn-based battles, we probably would have had it by now.

The new types and Special stat split was introduced in Gen II to balance the type chart and prevent Psychic domiance. Using Alakazam, Mewtwo or even Hypno in RBY was a near guaranteed win. Now, every Pokémon has some sort of check. Big threats like Salamence, Scizor and Garchomp don't have a double weakness to exploit for no reason.

In Gen III, they redid the IV/EV system and added natures; RBYGSC couldn't connect with Ruby and Sapphire and any subsequent games, which is why they took that opportunity to diversify each individual Pokémon even further. The battle system, however, remained for the most the same. Nothing was taken away from the battle system of RBYGSC; abilities were an addition to make the Pokémon seem more "realisitic".

As for Gen IV and the Special/Physical split; to be honest I don't know why this wasn't introduced sooner, as it only made sense. In retrospect, they were changing so much circa the advanced games, maybe they decided, as a marketing move, to hold off on this as it may have alienated the older players? I'm not sure. However, despite this split, the battle system still remained the same. Using Stun Spore, Psychic or Ice Beam in RBY to the casual player (ie. children) is pretty much the same as using it in DPPt.

 

[Ararararagi-san]

i say just keep it the way it is in hggs. It doesn't need to be revamped or anything. sometimes more of the same is better. they don't need to make any changes to battles. this isn't a new system, so they should just do what they're doing already

 

[Hyasynth]

The way they used it in HGSS was perfect. It was used enough to do the touch screen justice without going into overkill mode.

They shouldn't mess with it anymore than that.