What do you think of 4kids?

[Habunake]

this is not about the 4kids->PUSA, simply about edits, their views, and how the voices are handled. Let's leave Pokemon out of the equation, kay?

I personally dislike them, their Pokemon dub was the best one (GX is close..but no cigar). Most 4kids haters admit that.

1. Text EDITS! I know some people here think it is no big deal, but why?
I mainly mean ENGLISH text edits.

Why? Seems like a waste of money to me, and time. You think they would leave MILK so it gave the impression it wasn't a bar with alcohol (which 4kids obviously went for in this scene)

2. Death? Why is it taboo? I can understand like character being shown being shot, or killed. But they can die from natural causes? Almsot every kid nowadays knows someone who died, 4kids really undermines intelligence.

Of course, then their is instead of Kuina in OP falling down stairs and dying, they have her beat up by jealous students to the point of near death? Seriously, WTF?

3. Why liscenese shows that are obviously unsuitable for US standards for a kids cartoon. Mainly One Piece. Did they even look at it before buying it? You think with all the blood and mature themes they would of realized it will be hard to make it suitable!

4. Cutting episodes. This mainly happened in One Piece, they chopped and combined many episode. For what? That's like cutting out one of the Star Wars episodes because you didn't like it! If I was the original creators, I'd be pissed.

5. The voices. It's not the voice actors, IT'S whoever casts them and makes their lines.

Sanji should not sound like a gangster, even weirder is they give him a voice of a smoker...which would be fine if they didn't cut out his cigarette (which is an understandable edit).

Vivi from One Piece...most unemotional voice ever.

Chumley from Yugioh GX. Why make the fat guy a idiot with a love for food, and a very LD sounding voice?

Mad Dog from GX-

Why have this guy sound like a baby AND talk like a baby?

Len from Shaman King- Why does a clearly Chinese person sound British? Yet the ACTUAL British guy of the series (Lyserg) talk like an American? Seriously...WTF?

Aster Phoenix- A serious guy like him shouldn't sound like the missing brother of a Ninja Turtle.

Yami Yugi- Why I do find the voice funny, I can't help but wonder why a short teenager (technically) sounds as deep as Mad Dog should've sounded like?

Tyranno Hassleberry- What's with the "Sargeant" talk? I admit, I do find it funny, but considering 4kids tries to edit out "war", yet they have him use so many war references. I hope his actual dad shows up in the GX Anime later, and 4kids is screwed because they said he was a War Veteran, and it turns out he is a posh archaeologist.

As I said, it's not the voices so much, it's whoever makes the lines and cast them.

6. Gun Edits: I can understand Gun Edits...but seriously? I would take the "finger" of Yugioh then having Marine's using Super Soakers that shoot bullets....and Sticky Darts. Seriously, a kid is gonna find a gun and shoot themselves thinking they are "sticky" darts inside.

7. Alcohol and Cigarattes: I can understand cigarettes...

But seriously, what is so wrong showing alcohol in the background AT A BAR? I doubt Pirate's drank "Orange Soda" and got Acid Reflux from them. (seriously, their was a OP episode with that). Now, I can see you editing out the "boozing" scenes in One Piece. But most kids see alcohol ON A REGULAR BASIS! YOU AREN'T HIDING THEM FROM IT. I can see kids going into their cabinets aat home and drinking wine thinking it's "Fruit Juice".

8. Blood Edits....I get editing out the streaming blood, which One Piece has alot of (WHY DID YOU DECIDE TO DUB IT FOR SATURDAY MORNING FOR KIDS?) but editing out every little scar like they do in One Piece. Kids probably think they can't bleed now or get hurt from fighting.

9. In Comparison....

How come shows on at the same time, with the same rating, have less edits then 4kid's dubbed anime?

Spongebob says the word "death" and "die".
Compare all of Toonami's lineup with One Piece....(bar Naruto, since it has a higher rating). I mainly mean Zatch Bell.
Batman actually has guns (and they realize they "kill).....

Seriously.

And that is why I dislike 4kids as a dubbing company.

DISCUSS!


EDIT: Hear dubbed Mad Dog!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mAdygCoriU

Now wash away the sin after you do.

Here is him talking in the Japanese version, just in case...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBJpNuIEm5c&mode=related&search=

 

[XD375]

Nice...

You know, in Digimon, Matt and TK's Dad was smoking on the episode when they defeated VenomMyotismon.

4Kids cuts guns, yet Digimon have guns attached to their bodies.

I'm surprised I don't get nightmares of what 4Kids would've done to Digimon.

EDIT: Whoa, is this thread that old?

 

[Habunake]

I also wrote this when I was paticularly mad, did you have to revive it?

I sound horrible here...-_-

 

[Geodude]

They act like morons when it comes to anime, but they're pretty good with their American shows. TMNT, for example, is quite well-liked.

edit: Wow, didn't realize the date...this shouldn't have been bumped...

 

[XD375]

I also wrote this when I was paticularly mad, did you have to revive it?

I sound horrible here...-_-

The age of this thread...what was your name? King of the Internet? CyberCircle:Hikari Fan?

I liked your speech. I agree with [almost] all of it.

 

[XD375]

4Kids rapidly loses money. Back in '98, they didn't need to compose their own music, except for scenes with no sound whatsoever. Now, they can't afford the old music and can't even compose new music for newer seasons.

 

[Dogasu]

I've said it before, and I've said it again; blindly hating a company (which is what a lot of the people in this thread are doing) is stupid. However, hating the actions of a company is another thing. I may dislike 4Kids for making a ton of really really really really bad decisions, but I would never classify myself as a 4Kids hater because 4Kids haters typically bash the company even when they do something right.

I personally dislike them, their Pokemon dub was the best one (GX is close..but no cigar). Most 4kids haters admit that.

Well, Shaman King was decent, by 4Kids standards.

2. Death? Why is it taboo? I can understand like character being shown being shot, or killed. But they can die from natural causes? Almsot every kid nowadays knows someone who died, 4kids really undermines intelligence.

Of course, then their is instead of Kuina in OP falling down stairs and dying, they have her beat up by jealous students to the point of near death? Seriously, WTF?[/

Blame the FCC, not 4Kids. They're the ones who keep sending 4Kids notes about removing death from all their shows because kids apparently can't handle the concept.

It's the way they handle death that bothers me. I mean, sending Bellemère "to the dungeon" is beyond lame...couldn't they have come up with something better?

3. Why liscenese shows that are obviously unsuitable for US standards for a kids cartoon. Mainly One Piece. Did they even look at it before buying it? You think with all the blood and mature themes they would of realized it will be hard to make it suitable!

One Piece isn't a mature show by any stretch of the imagination. It's aimed for little kids in Japan, so it's only natural that it's aimed for little kids in the US as well.

The thing is, One Piece can be edited down to a TV-Y7 FV rating without changing that much, but unfortunately, 4Kids opted to reversion the show rather than translate it, which is why the dub is as bad as it is.

4. Cutting episodes. This mainly happened in One Piece, they chopped and combined many episode. For what? That's like cutting out one of the Star Wars episodes because you didn't like it! If I was the original creators, I'd be pissed.

Apparently, Toei was upset at 4Kids. The reason they even granted them the license in the first place is because they thought 4Kids would do for One Piece what they had done for Pokemon and Yu-Gi-Oh!, but when the show got its sub-par ratings, they got pissed.

5. The voices. It's not the voice actors, IT'S whoever casts them and makes their lines.

My problem with the 4Kids VA's is that they're directed to do cartoon voices instead of just speaking naturally, the way real people do. They spend so much of their energy trying to put on these "voices" that the acting takes a back seat, and that has a huge impact on shows like One Piece.

As I said, it's not the voices so much, it's whoever makes the lines and cast them.

I agree. Marc Diraison's Zolo is the best performance on the shipwreck that is the One Piece dub...however, his great performance is marred by all the horrible puns and jokes the writers make him deliver (i.e. the episode "Baroque Works").

6. Gun Edits: I can understand Gun Edits...but seriously? I would take the "finger" of Yugioh then having Marine's using Super Soakers that shoot bullets....and Sticky Darts. Seriously, a kid is gonna find a gun and shoot themselves thinking they are "sticky" darts inside.

The gun edits aren't that big a deal considering the nature of the One Piece world. I mean, when you have a shapeshifting reindeer doctor, a man who eats himself as one of his attacks (Wapol), a man who uses wax weapons with a big 3-shaped hair style (Mr. 3), and a an island inhabited fish people (Cocoyashi Village), a hammer gun or a suction cup gun isn't that all out of place.

But seriously, what is so wrong showing alcohol in the background AT A BAR?

Again, blame the FCC.

8. Blood Edits....I get editing out the streaming blood, which One Piece has alot of (WHY DID YOU DECIDE TO DUB IT FOR SATURDAY MORNING FOR KIDS?)

Probably because it's a KID'S SHOW.

but editing out every little scar like they do in One Piece. Kids probably think they can't bleed now or get hurt from fighting.

Again, blame the FCC.

And if you really think about it, One Piece, even edited, is probably 4Kids' most violent show. Don't forget; they left in things like Shanks' arm getting ripped off, Zoro getting stabbed by Buggy, Zeff's leg coming off (complete with blood!), Johnny and Yosaku's off-screen kiss, etc.

9. In Comparison....

How come shows on at the same time, with the same rating, have less edits then 4kid's dubbed anime?

Spongebob says the word "death" and "die".
Compare all of Toonami's lineup with One Piece....(bar Naruto, since it has a higher rating). I mainly mean Zatch Bell.
Batman actually has guns (and they realize they "kill).....

Because the overwhelming majority of 4Kids' edits aren't done for censorship reasons...they're done to make the show "more accessible." They still dub their shows like it's the mid-90's while failing to realize that kids today aren't turned off by Japanese names and rice balls.

Also...Nickelodeon actually has some pretty lax censors. I mean, they aired Ren & Stimpy for a number of years, and even the re-edited versions got away with some pretty risqué stuff for back in the day.

The Batman may have guns (I don't know...I've only seen a few episodes), but the censorship the show undergoes is still harsher than what Batman: The Animated Series was subjected to back in the day (which was still quite a lot).

 

[Trainer Lisa]

I like the company 4Kids.

I don't mind the mistakes they make either. Because when I watch the shows that they dub, in the end, the mistakes don't even matter. And they don't affect my enjoyment of the series in any way (though, I admit, that's probably because I don't watch the Japanese versions of any of their shows).


And it's true, I love all the 4Kids VAs. I've probably said that more than anyone else. I find every single VA to be extremely talented at what characters they voice. I don't know whether it's just the voices that I like, or the fact that the VAs seem to portray every character flawlessly. But the fact is, those VAs can make any 4Kids show enjoyable for me (though, I've never seen One Piece, so I can't comment on that show).



Anyway, these are the 3 4Kids shows I watch:


Pokemon (yes, I watch the reruns)

Kirby: Right Back At Ya

Sonic X (though, I don't think it's airing anymore, which is sad for me, since I missed a bunch of episodes back when it came on at the SAME TIME as Pokemon >_<)


I find it funny how all 3 of those shows happen to be based on video games, lol. XD

 

[XD375]

Sonic X is still viewable on "YTV's Animé On Demand", but it's only in Canada.

 

[Dogasu]

I know this is 4Kids hater-ish of me (especially considering that I just posted that I'm not a 4Kids hater), but I can't help but love every second of this.

 

[Blackjack Gabbiani]

I think they have potential, but they need to get a new boss to really blossom. With a dimwit like Kahn at the reigns, it doesn't look like the wittier and more intelligent people will get a chance to shine.

 

[The Big Al]

I think they hide behind FCC more than they really can. Either that or the FCC has it out for 4Kids. Granted some edits are needed but 4Kids takes it too far. I mean, the cross on a construction helmet?

And ignoring the editting 4Kids has one of the weakest VA pools. I think I've already made the comment how in 4Kids dubs 90% of the world's population sound like the same two people becaue their stock VA's have no voice range. Then there's the One Piece in which the people not only have annoying voices but can't act. Even their "best" VA's are only decent compared other companies VA's.

And to compound the issue of Voice Actors they have awful directors and scriptwriters who seem obessed with puns and exaggerating the worst qualities of the characters turning them into pale stereotypes coughJamesandUsoppcough. And dialogue changes frequently changes the plot of the episode and in mass the entire show, effectively making it completely different from the original version.

Fortunately only One Piece seems to have suffered from this perfect storm of errors.

But back to the editting. Alright, there are some things that would have to be editted but the extent of the edits on 4Kids shows is completely unjustified. It's taking FCC rules to their illogical conclusion. Then to add insult to injury they're sloppy about it. The only saving grace of the edits is that they seldomly affect the general plot (what I said above does that for them, this just makes it look bad).

 

[bell02+]

I don't know, compared to the comics, One Piece the Anime is a kitten compared to the comics (though that's true with most series). Maybe that's why I don't agree that it isn't children appropreate; its because it really is, and can get away with a Y-7 or PG rating easily.

I mean it does need edits, although not everything. I am by large not a supportter of alchol, but I think the over bearing nature that 4Kids made on the issue seem to tell little kids that "in the real world, they would be drinking wine and beer, but because its a cartoon its root beer and grape juice" which can give children the message the FCC didn't want them too (because they may go for the other when they pretend pirates). I think it can be established that's its root beer though editing of signs, etc. but I think it should be more of an don't ask don't tell (keeping it in the background so it isn't focused on by children)

As for smoking, I think that is where One Piece needs to be on CN and get the PG rating. I think its great that they kept Sanji's irony by making him eat candy (even though its against his original character nature of eating healthy), but I'm more of a fan of the tooth pick for him. Though if it was on CN with the PG rating, editing out the smoke would be the best edit to keep both sides happy. Meanwhile, a character like Smoker can bearly exsist without his pun, which is his crazy cigar addiction. (As seen in the 4Kids dub)

Generally, I think 4Kids voice actors are good, but their use has reached a point of exsotion. They are re-used so much, and placed in so many places where they shouldn't that it ruins their shows and make people think its the VA's fault.

No, they have proven themselves already with pleanty of times. Really I can't see this as fair or easy for them. Its also easy to pass the blame around, "its never my fault, the producers wanted it this way" but the direction and writing is consistantly horrible. The constant puns work well in series like Kirby and Pokemon, they are primarily comedy (although pokemon is more of a mix, it rarely takes itself as serious), opposed to other Jump series they own which tend to be a mix of both while keeping itself serious.

As for gun edits, it really is silly because they already look cartoony in One Piece. They look less realistic than Elmer Fudd's musket. I don't see a point in editing them.

I will consider myself a 4Kids hater because emotionally I feel it is true to myself, even though I think that 4Kids has done a lot of good. Right now, however, I'm at a point were I think they can't get better. Though I have to admit that if 4Kids didn't put a sticker on TMNT then it'd be hard to tell that its them, which shows high quality. I also feel that to company's dubbing started really well, Pokemon was great, and Yugioh had (and has with GX) some really fitting voice work (like I disaggree with Habunake's old comment on Yugi, he sounds exactly right, and fits just as much as the japanese one, as they go for the same style. Also characters like Bakura and Kaiba have fitting voices). Even programs I just didn't like like cubix, I can admit that the voice work was good.

However so many stupid things that they do makes me think that they are just so conservative as a company, that they don't want money. Which sound silly form a company which did a lot of pioneering in making popular cartoon shows. It just seems like a waiste

 

[Another Fan]

I don't give a damn about a company that just does what its name implies, caters for kids, besides that I am bothered by whiners. Look, sure the anime can actually be watched by adults in Japan, doesn't mean it is possible to make it good for the general public here and not cater to people who obsess over the japanese version.

I really doubt the japanese version was much better anyway. The plots of most stuff they dub is horribly cheesy and simple at best.

 

[XD375]

This isn't a One Peice thread, it's a 4Kids thread.

I think they have some great VAs, they just need more.

 

[Dogasu]

I don't give a damn about a company that just does what its name implies, caters for kids, besides that I am bothered by whiners. Look, sure the anime can actually be watched by adults in Japan, doesn't mean it is possible to make it good for the general public here and not cater to people who obsess over the japanese version.

Catering to kids is one thing. Completely gutting the show of all the qualities that made it so great in the first place is another.

I know that a lot of people will exaggerate how much better the Japanese version of an anime is over the English version, but in the case of One Piece, hyperboles aren't really needed. The English version really is a farce of an adaptation, and everyone - the fans, the audience 4Kids was trying to aim the show to, Toei - sees this. You can't cut out 39 episodes of a series and then say "oh, I'll bet the dub is that different from the original."

The plots of most stuff they dub is horribly cheesy and simple at best.

Watch the Japanese version of the Arlong arc and see if you're still saying that.

 

[Habunake]

It's more the fact that while the show was made for Kids in Japan, Japan has alot different standards. 4kids should be more wiser at where they aim it too. I think getting OP on Toonami first would of been better. CN seems alot laxer.

 

[The Big Al]

Prime Time cable has looser standards than Saturday Morning network. Even so, half of the editting and lopping was uncalled for and the FCC didn't tell them butcher the show's plot.

 

[XD375]

I think 4Sight should pick it up from the beginning.

 

[Habunake]

4Sight?