Cel identification help?

[Falconwing]

Giant Tentacruel episode? "Tentacool & Tentacruel"?

I can confirm that that isn't the episode.

 

[Showsni]

Trying to think of episodes with destroyed buildings I checked out Tentacool and Tentacruel and Showdown at Dark City, but it's neither of them.

It did remind me of Saffron when I first saw it...

 

[Cybersai]

Are you sure its not from a Johto episode? Ash/Brock wore their same old clothes in that saga too.

 

[Lysandre]

It could also be from Johto, that's included in The Original Series. I need to check some of those...

 

[nickstr]

Identifying scenes from episodes is quite often a challenge but easier for some than others. You have as many as 260 or so episodes to go through which is quite a feat but if you really like the original series it might not be all that bad.

 

[Lysandre]

No, it's really not, I love the original series and this is a great excuse to get back into it again. It would just be really nice to watch it AND know what episode I have a cel from, heheh.

 

[nickstr]

Quite so, I do too I hate Diamond and Pearl along with Advanced Generation and its about all I watch these days. But collecting cells really is something and if I could afford to (along with being able to find one) I would really like to get a cell from a Misty centered episode showing her. I know that animation cells go for quite a bit of money, hundreds sometimes thousands of dollars from research I did but actually owning a piece of an animated TV show or movie really is something and perhaps the ultimate collectible.

 

[Lysandre]

I can try to help you with that if I get a chance. And yes, AG/DP make me sad, so much less love goes into computer animation and I can't hang CGI on my wall XD Back when I did most of my collecting there was such an outburst from a few releases of them in Japan they were at 10-20 bucks each, maybe 100 for a cel with multiple people and an original background. It's a lot harder now but if I ever run across a Misty cel with a good price I'll try to hook you up.

 

[nickstr]

That would be cool, she is my absolute favorite from the TV series and it would be a first for me so should I actually go for this I would need to know how to properly care for animation cells but I suppose framing them and hanging them on the wall is good.

 

[Lysandre]

Yeah, they don't require that much. They are cellophane, pretty much plastic paper, and they always come on a nice cardstock backing. I would always run them to my friend who frames stuff at the mall and let her frame them with the sketches, never actually folding anything, but I have another cel and a sketch that I never framed just laying around somewhere in the packing material and it's fine. No huge care is required, a 10$ frame from Wal Mart would do just as good.

 

[nickstr]

Must have been the older acetate cells I have been thinking of then because I read a magazine article years back talking about the care they need to be placed under to avoid loosing them to what film buffs call the "vinegar syndrome" and to retouch the paint if needed. The Pokemon episodes themselves were shot on acetate based film (editing method gives it away) and could suffer from that type of decay if they are not stored in the right environment which is 60 degrees Fahrenheit and something like 50% humidity or less continuously.

 

[Lysandre]

Really...? Hmm... that's... not good to hear. All of mine have arrived with a bit of an aged look on the black, but I figured that's just how they look in person. Mine have not gotten worse, but they've also been coincidentally kept in just that type of environment...

Anyway, back for some more help.

I dug out this old cel (complete with receipt- 19.01 WITH taxes! It was a different world...) and I'd like any info on it before I ship it off to get framed. I'm almost 100% sure now after seeing it again that it's from the scene where Ash mopes after losing to Richie in the first league, but it could also be from any other scenes where a Pokemon left him or he's feeling emo. Accompanying sketch:

Spoiler

I also grabbed a higher quality pic of the other as-of-yet unidentified cel.

Spoiler

I find it somewhat amusing that, upon closer investigation, the distant fireplace reflects to make flames in Brock's pants, but that's another story.

Thanks again for your continued assistance guys!

 

[sunyshore]

to be honest the cel with ash and brock looks fake to me.... the art was simply never that bad back in those days. maybe nowadays you could find really badly drawn frames but... that looks fanmade did you have the layout sketch for it?

 

[Lysandre]

No, I don't, and so it's quite possible. The seller had good feedback but it was at the beginning of my collecting and I didn't examine it prior to sale as I have with the other cels posted. That could be it, because I too can't see any pose being quite as... off as that. I read somewhere around 90 percent of cels sold are fakes, so I generally consider them to be unless I have the sketch or an exact frame match to the show (I meticulously checked each detail on the cel from Pokemon Emergency, for example). I really should take the frame off of the cel in question and check it out, it may not even be on real cel paper or have the holes in the top to attach it to the board. That cel CAME in a frame, and a very defensively sealed frame, might I add...

 

[sunyshore]

sounds very fishy... definitely take it out and check it out, the cel and background ought to each have holes and identification notes...

http://sunyshore.com/raichu_cel02e.png

like that. your ash yelling and three pikachu cels look authentic though so, it's not too big a loss! they are really spectacular!

 

[Lysandre]

Thanks! You're right, it's really not, it's my least favorite anyway- I'd almost like to think it's a fake so I can feel better about the animators XD

Are you the guy that got all the cels from the Raichu episode, like the one you just posted?

 

[sunyshore]

i don't know about all, but i have two cels of raichu! and they came with a whole set of stuff about their production.

http://sunyshore.com/raichu_cel.shtml

there's a small niche of pokemon cel owners, i am very glad to be one now and always happy to meet others

 

[Lysandre]

Yep, you're the guy! I'm surprised how few of us there are out there! Awesome cels you've got there, as well, they look to be really well kept and in awesome condition. Cel collectors gotta stick together! 8)

EDIT: I also want to add, about your comment that the lines on Surge's face look lighter there than on the show... all of my cels have the same effect to some degree, although it's almost unnoticeable on the Pikachus cel. I think one of their paints dries differently or something, I hope it's not the "vinegar effect" mentioned above... the one we suspect to be fraudulent is almost ENTIRELY in that one shade of lightish paint for every outline...

 

[sunyshore]

Thanks! Glad you like them!

Well, it's technically cel fading on most cels - my Raichu standing with his paws on his hips had a bit here and there - it comes from aging, and Pokemon cels fade fast, according to Japanese collectors. My Surge + Raichu cel has a correction layer in the middle (kabuse cel layer) adding new lines and Raichu's white tummy, but it doesn't touch on Surge's head, which is entirely separate on its own layer. I suspect the kabuse layer didn't touch on it since it had other layers on top for him to talk and look up, so it was left with the original lines which are a bit weak (this the fix layer was needed).

That was confusing but hope it makes sense. It's my theory on that anyway XD

 

[Lysandre]

Haha, yeah, it does. That's what I assumed too. Oddly enough, I don't believe any of my cels are in layers... I haven't checked the weird (fake?) one, but the others all appear to be a single layer.

Mind if I ask where you got the Raichu cels? Just curious as a collector, I purchased all of mine on eBay back in the day and never saw as complete a collection of similar images as you have.