Controversial opinions

[DigitalGen6]

Personally, I just want main Eevees to do stuff outside of sitting on a girl's arms and looking cute. Heck, maybe start letting them evolve again for a change.

Yeah. Serena’s Eevee did that until it evolved.

If the mandatory MC Eevee isn't going to evolve I'd rather Freide catch it and then it becomes Captain Pikachu's Lieutenant or something along those lines.

That would be fun.

 

[skynerel]

May's pokemon tended not to get much screentime outside of their specific contest battles or the eps leading up to them almost similar to the way Journies handled Ash's Pokémon. Beautifly barely appeared in mid/late Hoenn for example. Skitty was used for a bit then got overshadowed by her Bulbasaur, and then all 3 of her Hoenn pokemon were dropped after Hoenn ended. Munchlax didn't do much till the middle of BF despite being captured before the Hoenn Grand Festival and Eevee hardly did anything of note outside the one contest it had against Brock. And of course Torchic was barely used for the first 80 episodes of Hoenn till it evolved.

Obviously May's pokemon were handled a bit better than Misty/Brock's pokemon from the OS (with the exception of Psyduck maybe) but never really got featured as much as Dawn or the later girls, despite the later female leads only having small teams or in some only 1 pokemon.

Misty’s pokemon tended to not get much screentime. Starmie spend very little time on her team and when it battled it mostly lost those battles to weak pokemon such as Ash’s Pigeotto and Giselle’s graveler (this one was even worse because it was a one shot). Then she was forced to leave it with her sisters and we barely ever saw it again. Staryu took its place and while it got the most amount of screentime for Misty’s pokemon it didn’t actually have any character development or learn any new attacks other than bubblebeam. Togepi did absolutely nothing other than random metronomes until it finally evolved into Togetic, just to be released. Goldeen was barely used and it’s only victory was against James Victreebell, not impressive. Horsea barely appeared as well and was quickly left at the gym. Psyduck was a running gag for its entire run with a few moments of competence (as long as someone bit its head to cause a headache). The fact that as a water type specialist her Psyduck couldn’t even learn to swim or attack without an induced headache it’s very telling about her skills as a trainer. Now Corsola did get a decent amount of screentime, with a couple of victories under her belt, but it had incredibly lackluster attacks such spike cannon and tackle. A water/rock pokemon without attacks that reflect her type specialty. Then we move to Poliwag, she captured him in the Orange Islands and didn’t do much at that stage, later evolved into Poliwhirl and finally to Politoed, where it got a few moments here and there. Azurill is just a togepi copy, but this one at least knows a few attacks it has control over. Gyarados did get one centric episode where it learn to work with Misty, I’ll give her that and it also learn to Mega Evolve. Despite its limited amount of screentime it got more development than most of her team, which again, it’s very telling considering some of her other pokemon travelled all of Kanto, Orange Islands and Johto with her. Clauncher, which was her last capture got quickly shafted and only appeared for 10 seconds in another episode before never been seen again. Her pokemon were less developed than all the other pokegirls that came after her. May, Dawn, Serena and even Iris gave their pokemon more moments to shine despite having less time to do so.

 

[R.O.B.]

Most of the worst Johto content is found in the more important episodes, not necessarily the filler.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

Speaking of Johto, the only good Remix of Pokemon Theme in English was way back in 2002 in Season 4's dub, IMO:

Pokémon: Johto League Champions ð | Opening Theme

Born to be a winner! Our heroes continue their journey through the Johto region with mysteries to solve, tough challenges, and more Pokémon battles. Jam out ...

www.youtube.com

I thought Season 17's Remix was an absolute butchery & mockery of Season 1's in the XY dub, Movie 20's was the least bad of the three TPCi Era ones but still flat and unmemorable, and the last one is somewhere in between (hampered by lazy choices of picture footage cropped in the ending scenes and a halfhearted, 30 second singing) but subpar as well + it won't age too well.

It's pretty unanimous 4Kids' intros/OPs were better than TPCi's intros/OPs for Pokémon for the dub ironically, but this isn't.

 

[sc190191]

I was thinking of making a thread for this, but I couldn't think of what to call it that would lead to people actually clicking on it, so if anyone likes this idea feel free to steal it for a thread! By its nature it fits in this thread too...

The idea is to consider how your overall opinion of each series differs from what you perceive to be the general opinion of that series. Feel free to break it up however much you want (by series, saga, arc), I'm going to break it up into as many sections as I think will be different enough from one another to matter without getting crazy in-depth. I'm going to use a scale, with 50 being average (I feel the same about said series as I feel the community does), 0 being the bottom (I hate this series a lot more than the community does), and 100 being the top (I love this series way more than I feel the community does). If anyone else does this feel free to use whatever ranking and scale that makes sense to you. And remember, this isn't a ranking of how much you love/hate a series as compared to one another or in general, but instead a ranking of how you feel about the series compared to how you feel the community as a whole feels about it. For example I will have BW higher than DP, that doesn't mean I like BW more than DP, it just means I like BW a lot more compared to the general consensus. Long intro aside, here we go:

OS - Indigo League: 48 (slightly below average) : Don't get me wrong I love the original Kanto season, I'm just very much not a genwunner and I don't believe it is as flawless as it can sometimes be perceived. That being said I'm putting my score very close to average because I do like it quite a bit.

Orange Islands: 77 (above average) : Now when I get nostalgic about original series I think about OI. I just love the entire vibe of the series, traveling on Lapras, tropical islands, unique plots and Pokemon, and just the right amount of OS wackiness. I think I like it well above average because many people complain not much happens and it is a filler (more on that below) arc, but not crazy above because I don't think it is hated as a saga.

Johto: 80 (above average) : Now I'm not saying I like Johto more than OI, but I am saying I like it more than average, because so many people knock Johto for the fillers. I personally love fillers and there are so many fantastic fillers I just love in this series! The pace maybe gets a tad slow at time, but I generally enjoy most of the episodes in Johto.

Advanced - Hoenn: 70 (above average) : My personal favorite series, I am a huge May fan and I love the Hoenn region (not too much water to me). I think this series is generally well received so my score isn't super high, but people tend to say not as well written than DP, and while I respect that I just think AG is more fun!

Advanced - Battle Frontier: 55 (slightly above average) : The VA change is really hard to swallow, but this series has a ton of fun moments. I'm only slightly above average because I think this series is reasonably well received and I still have some trouble really immersing in the first few episodes after the switch, but I still really love the cast and enjoy a lot of the episodes.

DP: 50 (pretty much average) : Well it seems to me a lot of people like this series, and I like it as well. Pretty simple answer.

BW: 89 (Way above average) : This will be my highest score here, I do understand the issues with this series and I generally find them bothersome, but I personally love Iris (my Iris above average score would have to be 99), I also really love Cilan and his quirks, I think the group typically works really well together (like teasing your friends isn't a bad thing...), and I feel this series has a lot of really fun episodes. Knowing what is wrong with it and not worrying about it has allowed me to really love this series on rewatches.

BW - Decolore: 94 (way above average) : Okay I lied, I have a higher score. Combine the fact that I love BW with the fact that I love Island hopping filler sagas and this was certainly a series I was bound to love more than others. I certainly don't love it nearly as much as OI, but I did really enjoy a ton of the adventures here (except the stupid Iris/Ash split that should've happened in season one), in fact some of my BW favorites are here such as 127, 135, and especially the hilarious 139. I also liked the return of a real transition (Alexa). Since there is a ton of BW hate, filler hate, and specific hate to this series, it probably is the one I like the most as compared to the community. I was thinking 99, but I do think some people do like some of these, so I don't want to get too wild with my score!

XY: 70 (Above average) : I actually really enjoyed this series and I thought it was shaping up to be one of the better series (more on that below). I love the entire cast and the way they work together, I loved the balance of super fun episodes, training, and use of other characters. I think a lot of people liked XY (although a lot of haters developed too), so I think this is a fair score.

XYZ: 45 (slightly below average) : I've written about this before, but I personally believe there was a pretty stark difference here. I still liked XYZ (especially Bonnie's expanded role), but I do think it got a little too serious, and had some big misses (what losing streak?). It also felt extraordinarily rushed to me as compared to the pace of XY. I think XYZ is controversial in general so I'm trying to average that out, I like it less than the big time supporters, but more than the haters.

SM: 20 (way below average) : Speaker of haters, that's me for SM. Big caveat that I would have given this a zero 2 years ago, I did rewatch this series (I watch an episode every night before bed to relax and it was on PTV and I didn't want other series to get too stale) and knowing what to expect allowed to me enjoy some episodes more. That being said this series just didn't fit me at all, I've written about this a lot before so just a quick summary I really didn't like the school setting, I hated the artwork, I really didn't like the constant slapstick (the style of humor and especially the choice of when to use it), I don't prefer the slice of life, I didn't really love any main characters (Lillie is the closest, but I still prefer game Lillie), and I didn't like the flow/progression. I got the feeling on here that a lot of people loved this series (while some didn't) so I think I am well below average, but since I do enjoy some of the fillers quite a bit (059, 080, 093, 094, and a few others to a lesser extent), and I never totally quit the series, I didn't want to go too low on my score.

JN: 65 (above average) : I honestly would probably rank JN as my second least favorite series to SM, but as I'm finally catching up and I'm reading reviews on here I'm pretty surprised by how much some people disliked it. I get that it isn't written super well, but I still get a lot of enjoyment from many of the episodes. I do think Goh's goal is heartless and doesn't match with the rest of the anime (and I did even quit for a while for the first time because of it), but the goal did get toned down some and I honestly don't dislike Goh as a character other than the goal (wow does he get a lot of hate here). I really enjoy Chloe and also enjoy the callbacks, even if they are just "fan service". Long story short, it isn't great, but it certainly isn't as bad (to me) as a lot of people make it out to be.

HZ: TBD : Wacky (dub) Watcher here, won't see this for a long time! And yes I love that episode if you get the reference...

On average I scored a 63.5 (of course if I wanted to get really crazy I could scale that by episode count, but not feeling that wild today). I think that is a fair score as I am generally not too negative (unless talking about SM), and I really love the anime and have for a long time and rewatch frequently, so I think it is fair to say I probably like it a bit more than the average person in the community.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

I was thinking of making a thread for this, but I couldn't think of what to call it that would lead to people actually clicking on it, so if anyone likes this idea feel free to steal it for a thread! By its nature it fits in this thread too...

The idea is to consider how your overall opinion of each series differs from what you perceive to be the general opinion of that series. Feel free to break it up however much you want (by series, saga, arc), I'm going to break it up into as many sections as I think will be different enough from one another to matter without getting crazy in-depth. I'm going to use a scale, with 50 being average (I feel the same about said series as I feel the community does), 0 being the bottom (I hate this series a lot more than the community does), and 100 being the top (I love this series way more than I feel the community does). If anyone else does this feel free to use whatever ranking and scale that makes sense to you. And remember, this isn't a ranking of how much you love/hate a series as compared to one another or in general, but instead a ranking of how you feel about the series compared to how you feel the community as a whole feels about it. For example I will have BW higher than DP, that doesn't mean I like BW more than DP, it just means I like BW a lot more compared to the general consensus. Long intro aside, here we go:

OS - Indigo League: 48 (slightly below average) : Don't get me wrong I love the original Kanto season, I'm just very much not a genwunner and I don't believe it is as flawless as it can sometimes be perceived. That being said I'm putting my score very close to average because I do like it quite a bit.

Orange Islands: 77 (above average) : Now when I get nostalgic about original series I think about OI. I just love the entire vibe of the series, traveling on Lapras, tropical islands, unique plots and Pokemon, and just the right amount of OS wackiness. I think I like it well above average because many people complain not much happens and it is a filler (more on that below) arc, but not crazy above because I don't think it is hated as a saga.

Johto: 80 (above average) : Now I'm not saying I like Johto more than OI, but I am saying I like it more than average, because so many people knock Johto for the fillers. I personally love fillers and there are so many fantastic fillers I just love in this series! The pace maybe gets a tad slow at time, but I generally enjoy most of the episodes in Johto.

Advanced - Hoenn: 70 (above average) : My personal favorite series, I am a huge May fan and I love the Hoenn region (not too much water to me). I think this series is generally well received so my score isn't super high, but people tend to say not as well written than DP, and while I respect that I just think AG is more fun!

Advanced - Battle Frontier: 55 (slightly above average) : The VA change is really hard to swallow, but this series has a ton of fun moments. I'm only slightly above average because I think this series is reasonably well received and I still have some trouble really immersing in the first few episodes after the switch, but I still really love the cast and enjoy a lot of the episodes.

DP: 50 (pretty much average) : Well it seems to me a lot of people like this series, and I like it as well. Pretty simple answer.

BW: 89 (Way above average) : This will be my highest score here, I do understand the issues with this series and I generally find them bothersome, but I personally love Iris (my Iris above average score would have to be 99), I also really love Cilan and his quirks, I think the group typically works really well together (like teasing your friends isn't a bad thing...), and I feel this series has a lot of really fun episodes. Knowing what is wrong with it and not worrying about it has allowed me to really love this series on rewatches.

BW - Decolore: 94 (way above average) : Okay I lied, I have a higher score. Combine the fact that I love BW with the fact that I love Island hopping filler sagas and this was certainly a series I was bound to love more than others. I certainly don't love it nearly as much as OI, but I did really enjoy a ton of the adventures here (except the stupid Iris/Ash split that should've happened in season one), in fact some of my BW favorites are here such as 127, 135, and especially the hilarious 139. I also liked the return of a real transition (Alexa). Since there is a ton of BW hate, filler hate, and specific hate to this series, it probably is the one I like the most as compared to the community. I was thinking 99, but I do think some people do like some of these, so I don't want to get too wild with my score!

XY: 70 (Above average) : I actually really enjoyed this series and I thought it was shaping up to be one of the better series (more on that below). I love the entire cast and the way they work together, I loved the balance of super fun episodes, training, and use of other characters. I think a lot of people liked XY (although a lot of haters developed too), so I think this is a fair score.

XYZ: 45 (slightly below average) : I've written about this before, but I personally believe there was a pretty stark difference here. I still liked XYZ (especially Bonnie's expanded role), but I do think it got a little too serious, and had some big misses (what losing streak?). It also felt extraordinarily rushed to me as compared to the pace of XY. I think XYZ is controversial in general so I'm trying to average that out, I like it less than the big time supporters, but more than the haters.

SM: 20 (way below average) : Speaker of haters, that's me for SM. Big caveat that I would have given this a zero 2 years ago, I did rewatch this series (I watch an episode every night before bed to relax and it was on PTV and I didn't want other series to get too stale) and knowing what to expect allowed to me enjoy some episodes more. That being said this series just didn't fit me at all, I've written about this a lot before so just a quick summary I really didn't like the school setting, I hated the artwork, I really didn't like the constant slapstick (the style of humor and especially the choice of when to use it), I don't prefer the slice of life, I didn't really love any main characters (Lillie is the closest, but I still prefer game Lillie), and I didn't like the flow/progression. I got the feeling on here that a lot of people loved this series (while some didn't) so I think I am well below average, but since I do enjoy some of the fillers quite a bit (059, 080, 093, 094, and a few others to a lesser extent), and I never totally quit the series, I didn't want to go too low on my score.

JN: 65 (above average) : I honestly would probably rank JN as my second least favorite series to SM, but as I'm finally catching up and I'm reading reviews on here I'm pretty surprised by how much some people disliked it. I get that it isn't written super well, but I still get a lot of enjoyment from many of the episodes. I do think Goh's goal is heartless and doesn't match with the rest of the anime (and I did even quit for a while for the first time because of it), but the goal did get toned down some and I honestly don't dislike Goh as a character other than the goal (wow does he get a lot of hate here). I really enjoy Chloe and also enjoy the callbacks, even if they are just "fan service". Long story short, it isn't great, but it certainly isn't as bad (to me) as a lot of people make it out to be.

HZ: TBD : Wacky (dub) Watcher here, won't see this for a long time! And yes I love that episode if you get the reference...

On average I scored a 63.5 (of course if I wanted to get really crazy I could scale that by episode count, but not feeling that wild today). I think that is a fair score as I am generally not too negative (unless talking about SM), and I really love the anime and have for a long time and rewatch frequently, so I think it is fair to say I probably like it a bit more than the average person in the community.

> Someone who did not rank Johto, BW, or JN at the bottom, or XY or DP at the top

Refreshing, tbh, I'll give you my thoughts as well later on in this thread, since they deviate from the norm as well tbh (not the dub, though, 100% agree with the majority it was better pre-BF).

 

[Bendicion]

Dawn's goal was also more defined and used than May's too. The fact that Dawn knew what she wanted to do right at the start of DP gave her a pretty significant advantage. It didn't take her as long to participate in her first Contest or get her first ribbon compared to May who took over 50 episodes just to get one. It may sound like a small detail, but that allowed for Dawn to become more proactive with her goal a lot sooner. Checking the first season of DP, it's actually amazing how many focus episodes Dawn has, her first battle, capture, contest, ribbon all come very early on. Having a longer season dedicated to a single arc helps, but even without that by episode 130-140 (average end of a 3-year series) Dawn has shown tremendous character development and achievements and has settled into her own unique personality compared to May's bland personality. Overall, following her arc seems much more interesting and eventful than May's, simply because there's so much Dawn content in DP. Most importantly, she is seen receiving focus even with non-goal related plots - something that was rare in AG.

 

[Hidden Mew]

Dawn's goal was also more defined and used than May's too. The fact that Dawn knew what she wanted to do right at the start of DP gave her a pretty significant advantage. It didn't take her as long to participate in her first Contest or get her first ribbon compared to May who took over 50 episodes just to get one. It may sound like a small detail, but that allowed for Dawn to become more proactive with her goal a lot sooner. Checking the first season of DP, it's actually amazing how many focus episodes Dawn has, her first battle, capture, contest, ribbon all come very early on. Having a longer season dedicated to a single arc helps, but even without that by episode 130-140 (average end of a 3-year series) Dawn has shown tremendous character development and achievements and has settled into her own unique personality compared to May's bland personality. Overall, following her arc seems much more interesting and eventful than May's, simply because there's so much Dawn content in DP. Most importantly, she is seen receiving focus even with non-goal related plots - something that was rare in AG.

I wouldn't consider May's personality bland, but otherwise, I completely agree. Dawn having her goal right off the bat really helped with her focus early on. It does make sense why it took longer for May to decide on her goal and to get her first ribbon, especially when Contests were brand new at the time, but I think that affected how much they could do with her storyline. It's a bit similar to Serena's storyline in that regard.

That being said, Dawn does benefit a lot from being the second Coordinator in the cast. They were able to figure out what works and what doesn't work for Contests, finally figured out how to make Contest battles more distinct from regular battles and they only had one Contests arc for Dawn. Cramming in two Contest arcs for May, while understandable given the pacing of AG, really limited what they could do. There were Contests that May should have lost or not made it past the first round, but they didn't really have the time to give May a losing streak like they did with Dawn. DP having four years to cover the entire Sinnoh journey really helped out with a lot of its storylines in general too.

 

[Ghost Diplocaulus]

Yeah. Serena’s Eevee did that until it evolved.

I actually disagree here: Serena's Eevee had a clear arc about conquering her crippling shyness and opening herself up to others, so she definitely wasn't there just to be cute like the Eevees that succeeded her.

 

[DigitalGen6]

I actually disagree here: Serena's Eevee had a clear arc about conquering her crippling shyness and opening herself up to others, so she definitely wasn't there just to be cute like the Eevees that succeeded her.

Oh yeah I forgot about that, thanks for reminding me.

 

[FelipePR]

Dawn has shown tremendous character development and achievements and has settled into her own unique personality compared to May's bland personality. Overall, following her arc seems much more interesting and eventful than May's, simply because there's so much Dawn content in DP.

One cannot leave it to be puzzled why you put so much focus on criticizing May, and everything around her, so that, even when you expose your preferences in relation to anime, you feel the constant need to negatively compare the aforementioned character.

Not that any character is irreproachable and, therefore, above any criticism, but it is, to say the least, sad when, apparently, the main interest of a fan of the franchise is to disapprove and denigrate a certain character.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

One cannot leave it to be puzzled why you put so much focus on criticizing May, and everything around her, so that even when you expose your preferences in relation to anime, you feel the constant need to negatively compare the aforementioned character.

Not that any character is irreproachable and, therefore, above any criticism, but it is, to say the least, sad, when, apparently, the main interest of a fan of the franchise is, apparently, to disapprove and denigrate a certain character.

It's interesting the user hates May's OG dub VA, too, considering it's by far considered the one that suited her best in the English run to a vast majority of people, and the ones that came after were widely criticized & disliked by a majority of people as well or considered subpar at best. They transferred their hatred of May the character, to the VA who best suited her to many, for no apparent reason to me.

I hated Brock in DP, but not the character outright: it would be more specific to say whether they hated May in Hoenn, BF, or DP, rather than outright but I thought she was the basic template for what Dawn had occur later on & additionally, it's arguable May was a more original incarnation w/Pokemon Contests the first go round as well as a less-Ash like progression than what occurred in DP as well, so she had some merits to her as well.

 

[Bendicion]

It seems like they gave Dawn more of a starring role than they gave May. The Japanese text calls DP "The adventures of Ash, Dawn, and Pokemon" but in AG it just called it "The adventures of Ash and Pokemon" as if they were saying that May wasn't supposed to have as big of a starring role as Ash. (at least that's how it felt to me)

Plus Dawn is usually in the center of the eye-catches or shares the spotlight with Ash and Brock in the background. She got her own theme song as well and it got remixed about 3 times and played several times throughout the anime, as well as in some of the movies while May didn't get a theme song until the tail end of AG right when it was almost time for her to leave. May's theme wasn't even introduced as hers because it first played as an insert song. Not to mention that Dawn's debut episode was almost entirely about her while May's was mostly about Ash and Pikachu. They also treated Piplup better as a mascot then they did with Torchic who stayed in the Pokeball for about 80 episodes until it evolved.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

It seems like they gave Dawn more of a starring role than they gave May. The Japanese text calls DP "The adventures of Ash, Dawn, and Pokemon" but in AG it just called it "The adventures of Ash and Pokemon" as if they were saying that May wasn't supposed to have as big of a starring role as Ash. (at least that's how it felt to me)

Plus Dawn is usually in the center of the eye-catches or shares the spotlight with Ash and Brock in the background. She got her own theme song as well and it got remixed about 3 times and played several times throughout the anime, as well as in some of the movies while May didn't get a theme song until the tail end of AG right when it was almost time for her to leave. May's theme wasn't even introduced as hers because it first played as an insert song. Not to mention that Dawn's debut episode was almost entirely about her while May's was mostly about Ash and Pikachu. They also treated Piplup better as a mascot then they did with Torchic who stayed in the Pokeball for about 80 episodes until it evolved.

Perhaps for the female lead, but it proves how much Brock got axed in DP vs AG, and TRio got even more flanderized, so there were those serious drawbacks IMO to DP being exactly that. To me, AG felt more about, "The adventures of Ash, Brock, May, and Pokemon" in comparison.

Brock was never as good as he was in OS, but AG was his second least useless incarnation (he's insufferable in DP to me, just intolerable, his SM-JN incarnations suck less but still forgettable in comparison to OS-AG to me- he sucks in the dub hard though post-BF, IMO).

 

[Hidden Mew]

It seems like they gave Dawn more of a starring role than they gave May. The Japanese text calls DP "The adventures of Ash, Dawn, and Pokemon" but in AG it just called it "The adventures of Ash and Pokemon" as if they were saying that May wasn't supposed to have as big of a starring role as Ash. (at least that's how it felt to me)

Most series do just say that they're about the adventures of Ash and Pikachu or some variation of that. The only characters who were included before were both Dawn and Goh in DP and Journeys respectively. So I don't really see how that makes May stand out or be less of a main character when the vast majority of traveling companions weren't given top billing in the intros or text of their respective series either. May wasn't exactly a co-lead like Dawn was, but I wouldn't say that she didn't have a big starring role either. May battling frequently for her Contests was still a big deal at the time since Misty didn't do a lot of battling in the original series, let alone actively make progress in her goal.

Plus Dawn is usually in the center of the eye-catches or shares the spotlight with Ash and Brock in the background. She got her own theme song as well and it got remixed about 3 times and played several times throughout the anime, as well as in some of the movies while May didn't get a theme song until the tail end of AG right when it was almost time for her to leave. May's theme wasn't even introduced as hers because it first played as an insert song. Not to mention that Dawn's debut episode was almost entirely about her while May's was mostly about Ash and Pikachu. They also treated Piplup better as a mascot then they did with Torchic who stayed in the Pokeball for about 80 episodes until it evolved.

Dawn is a popular character and had a lot of spotlight in DP since she was basically a co-protagonist in all but name. I don't think May not getting as much music or featured in the eye catches makes her less of a main character by comparison though. To be fair, the first episode of AG was following up the cliffhanger ending with Pikachu getting sick right before they arrived in Hoenn. They kind of had to keep the focus on Ash and Pikachu with that in mind. It wasn't like May was an afterthought in that episode either. They started off the episode with May's arrival, told the audience that she prefers traveling over Pokemon, adapted the opening of R/S with May saving Professor Birch from wild Poocheyna, helped save Ash and Pikachu as they were falling off a cliff, got her first Pokemon and decided to travel with Ash and Pikachu. She wasn't the main star like Dawn was in DP, but she still got a good amount of screentime and it was a fairly decent introduction for her character. AG didn't end on a cliffhanger, so they had more freedom to devote more screentime for Dawn in the first DP episode by comparison.

I never got the impression that Torchic was supposed to be a mascot. Unlike a lot of other female leads, I don't think that May really had one extremely marketable/secondary mascot Pokemon despite having a lot of starters on her team. I don't recall Torchic being in its Pokeball most of the time prior to its evolution, but I don't think it was treated particularly well. I always thought it was a shame that May didn't use Torchic in at least the appeal round of a Contest before it evolved. It had more moves and power as a Combusken of course, but I think it could have done at least something in a Contest beforehand. Piplup was treated as a mascot and was handled better by comparison. Although, the transition from Piplup being in its Pokeball to being outside all the time is still really jarring. People were pretty annoyed with how much attention it got back in the day too. I think Piplup works better looking back at DP, especially when its increase in strength is gradual and pretty believable.

 

[Falaish]

It seems like they gave Dawn more of a starring role than they gave May. The Japanese text calls DP "The adventures of Ash, Dawn, and Pokemon" but in AG it just called it "The adventures of Ash and Pokemon" as if they were saying that May wasn't supposed to have as big of a starring role as Ash. (at least that's how it felt to me)

Plus Dawn is usually in the center of the eye-catches or shares the spotlight with Ash and Brock in the background. She got her own theme song as well and it got remixed about 3 times and played several times throughout the anime, as well as in some of the movies while May didn't get a theme song until the tail end of AG right when it was almost time for her to leave. May's theme wasn't even introduced as hers because it first played as an insert song. Not to mention that Dawn's debut episode was almost entirely about her while May's was mostly about Ash and Pikachu. They also treated Piplup better as a mascot then they did with Torchic who stayed in the Pokeball for about 80 episodes until it evolved.

Most of the first ep of AG is about May, showing her help Birch with Poochyena and later Ash and choose her starter, while the rest was about Pikachu being overcharged. In fact the very first scene in AG is May introducing herself on her bike. In the Japanese AG eyecatchers May is right in the center of all the companions too.

I'm confused what point you're trying to make here, how does Dawn being a co-star mean anything less about May? Dawn came after her so of course she got a little more focus. Misty got the least of the first 3 girls, then May and then Dawn so there was a natural progression. May got more screentime than every other female lead so why are you trying so hard to degrade her role...?

 

[sc190191]

Journeys may not have been well put together and its own storylines may have been lacking some, but in several instances it sure did a very good job of wrapping up/continuing on storylines from prior series. I'm still not fully caught up (just about to start M8 - I'm really slow), but having just watched several JN eps that I felt were excellent in this regard I wanted to put down some of my thoughts while it was fresh, and being far too late to use epi reviews I thought this was a good topic:

Wrap up of Lillie's story: I think we all thought this would get wrapped up eventually, but with the chance it might just be some flash scenes, instead we got an incredibly well done emotion filled episode. Ash saving Lillie at the perfect time was an eye roll, but what proceeded that I thought was an amazing little detail: Pikachu picked up on Lillie's specific scent - I just thought that was awesome, re watched the scene and only Pikachu reacts (and gets really excited) while Grookey and Eevee don't know what's going on - such a small detail, but I loved it! Overall this was a really heartfelt, emotional episode and I'm glad this was given a strong conclusion!

Alola Champion continuation: This actually started with the All-Out brothers recognizing Ash as champion and looking up to him, which was a super fun little touch (and Goh's reaction was awesome), and then was continued in a huge way in the final Alola episode. Even as someone who didn't love S&M I couldn't help but love all the attention to detail, character reappeances, and general love and respect the entire cast had for Ash (and in the Battle Royal the desire to beat him, but also help him prepare for the tournament). Honestly teared up with the "champion" chants, that was really intense and super well done. And it makes sense the region would want their champion to do well (even down to Tapu Koko), so it was a super cool moment! Also Kukui saying welcome home each Alola visit was a fun touch.

Serena Independence and Confidence: The Serena episode was so fantastic, thinking back on it it is hard to believe it was just 20 minutes. An episode that managed to be a Chloe episode (with good focus/advancement for Chloe) that also included a satisfying first appearance of an interesting game character (Lisia), an honestly pretty fun battle for Ash with a former champion (Wallace), and still have enough time to show how much Serena has grown since XY ended was just amazing! After traveling by herself Serna got a huge boost in her independence and confidence and she showed the ability to use her skills to help someone else (Chloe in this case), which was a microcosm of the goal she set for herself when she advanced from trying to make herself happy into trying to make others happy. I just loved Serena spitting back my favorite Ash quote of all time "there's nothing you could ever do that's a waste of time" (something I have thought in my head ever since I first heard it) and using it to really help Chloe just like it helped her back when. I was also very satisfied with the excuse for Ash not being there (a funny battle with Wallace and honestly a fine reason for Wallace wanting to battle) and the Ash/Serena encounter was well done (and proved that while Serena still really values Ash she doesn't "need" him) - a satisfying "correction" on their first departure.

Paul helping Ash Train: I know people felt Paul's inclusion was late/rushed/etc, but I honestly thought it wound up being an amazing inclusion. To me this was a perfect continuation of the Paul/Ash rivalry and how they interacted with each other. Last we saw Paul he had finally gained respect for Ash, but even before that he always had a fixation on Ash and his style (as noted by Reggie). What I absolutely love about this episode is that Paul is still acting exactly like himself, but without saying as much he obviously wants Ash to win the M8. Bringing a team that directly prepares Ash for the tournament and making sure Ash uses his tournament team against him, the little grin at the end after Goh pointed it out (and then leaving without saying much) it was honestly perfect and so Paul - as it makes total sense he wouldn't get sentimental or state he wants to help Ash, but clearly he does value Ash as a rival and because of their history he wants to see him succeed. Love him or hate him Paul was one of the more important people to Ash's development (and Ash one of the most important people to Paul's development) so his inclusion was really important, and I think this was a very powerful episode without outright saying much.

Gary's inclusion: I actually felt they did an excellent job of reusing Gary for Goh in the same way they used him for Ash. Belittling Goh at first, but with a wink wink trying to get the best out of him (that Ash totally understood the whole time) and then eventually coming to respect him. It was honestly fun to have Gary acting like he did in Gen 1, while still acting like normal towards Ash in a way where it made sense why he was acting like that because he was doing it on purpose. The project Mew was kind of silly as an attempt to give Goh something tangible, but as it was set up it made sense for Gary to join it because it related to his readjusted goal of following his grandfather and this series gave Gary some real progression and made him formidable again (DP kind of made him look bad in battle).

Iris: I already wrote about Iris' return in depth, so I'll keep it brief here, but I was really happy with that episode and seeing how Iris has progressed and looking forward to seeing her in M8 (even though I know she doesn't win any).

Other honorable mentions (some smaller items that were really cool, but didn't have quite the same level of impact):
-Ash's old Pokemon got more love than they had in over a decade, with specific personalities being kept in tact (for the most part) and many were given an opportunity to help train prior to the big tournament, showing his whole team still supports him. This was in huge contrast to the beginning of the series when Ash neglected all his old Pokemon to use Mimey - they sure came a long way in 3 years...if only the entire series had the same attitude as the last 1.5 yrs...
-Team Rocket kind of got shafted this series, but the radio show episode was a really fun showcase of their never-ending talent and a great way to wink back at the better times. Also got a fun TR Alola-family reunion (even if it was short) and the Butch/Cassidy post TR life was certainly interesting to see as was that adventure in general. Also Meowth crush on Chloe was just adorable and a bit of a nod to when Meowth used to fall in love at least once per series.
---Edit - OMG just saw the Lance/Diantha episode and just loved Jessie's obsession with Gourgeist! This is the exact kind of thing ALL past series used to dance around when a main character saw a Pokemon they had significant past experiences with and didn't really react or minimally reacted (& dexed them in Ash's case...) I just love so much that they showed Jessie cheering for Diantha just because of Gourgeist!
-Dawn got a lot of love in JN, and although I don't think any of her (many) episodes were as touching as any of the above, I really did love her interaction's with Chloe and it was just really fun to see so much of her for the first time in so long!
-Clemont/Bonnie episode wasn't as much a love letter to the past as some of the others, but it was amazing to see them again and Clemont helped Ash train (showing the importance of his past adventures leading to the present as well as how his many friends are there to help him) and Bonnie was adorable as always (and of course she loved Dracovish - that was so her!)
-Korrina's involvement level was a pretty cool nod to the fact that she was probably the closest Gym Leader friend to Ash other than the Gym Leaders he traveled with. I always enjoyed their relationship, and seeing Korrina so much again was great - as well as her helping Ash/Lucario (although that episode wasn't perfect)
-On a similar note I enjoyed all of Cynthia's episodes (I cried so hard on the Cleffa one - lost my dog/best friend this year) and it was fun to see her so frequently again. Beyond being the amazing champion they bring back for promotion they managed to keep all aspects of Cynthia's character that was always well done in the anime as well as her relationships with Ash, Dawn, and Brock. It would have meant more to me if Cynthia was the final because I see her as the best Pokemon champion and a better rival for Ash considering their much longer history, but too bad.
-Poor May, poor KAORI. I would imagine in a perfect world May would have had the chance to have an amazing episode like some of the others above, or at the very least have the Glaceon Chloe studied. I honestly feel more bad for KAORI than anything else, as I've previously discussed. With so many wonderful episodes coming out of this series I will always wonder how they would have included my favorite fictional character of all time, but at least we'll always have the wonderful four years that was AG

 

[SunGodNika1997]

There are plenty of issues I have with the ending, but I don't understand why people wanted Ash to take down Giovanni so badly. If they had built it up in JN, maybe it could have worked, but there was no way it was gonna happen in an 11-episode mini-series like some had thought. Would have been so forced.

 

[AgedVeteranofShow]

There are plenty of issues I have with the ending, but I don't understand why people wanted Ash to take down Giovanni so badly. If they had built it up in JN, maybe it could have worked, but there was no way it was gonna happen in an 11-episode mini-series like some had thought. Would have been so forced.

I think they should've built up to it prior, per se, the issue stems from JN not doing so in general (it was one of the weaker Series, despite being Ash's finale, oddly enough IMO).

 

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

There are plenty of issues I have with the ending, but I don't understand why people wanted Ash to take down Giovanni so badly. If they had built it up in JN, maybe it could have worked, but there was no way it was gonna happen in an 11-episode mini-series like some had thought. Would have been so forced.

I think its just a matter of it being something people have wanted to see for years. We finally got a confrontation in BW but Ash didn't really get to beat him. To this day, Team Rocket is the only major villainous organization that still stands. The rest were either defeated or turned over a new leaf. It was a loose end that never got tied.

I'm more annoyed though with the conclusion to Jessie, James, and Meowth's story though. Personally I wish they just retired to Alola and started up a business there rather than continuing to follow Ash and Pikachu. They saw a taste of a Team Rocket-less life with Butch and Cassidy. They should have got that happy ending rather than just continuing on following Ash.