General Chat Thread

[Rainami]

Natural Cure is far better. Gets rid of statuses when you switch out. I'd rather have that over an ability where it only works if your opponent swaps out.

Is it really, now? Getting rid of paralysis is useful, I give you that. And sleep, to a lesser extent, though that also opens up the possibility of another Pokemon being put to sleep upon Starmie being cured. Burn and poison aren't that big of a deal for it, it's a special attacking fast offensive Pokemon - getting burned or poisoned isn't the end of the world for it. Heck, it can even be beneficial, preventing it from being paralyzed or put to sleep.

You can argue that Natural Cure is a better ability for it, but it's definitely not "far better".

Analytic is generally considered better

I see. That's kinda what I thought, the extra power can help it break down walls that switch in on it. Wheras Natural Cure mostly only deals with sleep and paralysis, as I mentioned. Which is still cool.

 

[Slife]

@-Glory Blaze-; Why do you consider Excadrill to have the better typing? There is no objective "better typing" in this case. Their worth as a type should be judged based on their suitability to the respective teams they are used on.

Starmie has its own versatility and value as a special spinner, with competition only from Mega Blastoise (but then you'd be giving up a Mega spot).

 

[TerraTF]

@-Glory Blaze-; Why do you consider Excadrill to have the better typing? There is no objective "better typing" in this case. Their worth as a type should be judged based on their suitability to the respective teams they are used on.

Starmie has its own versatility and value as a special spinner, with competition only from Mega Blastoise (but then you'd be giving up a Mega spot).

I sort of went over their best suitabilities in my post. Overall Starmie is much better in Rain, behind maybe Tentacruel, but Excadrill is best in most situations due to his 3 great abilities.

 

[UB-01 Kenobi]

@-Glory Blaze-; Why do you consider Excadrill to have the better typing? There is no objective "better typing" in this case. Their worth as a type should be judged based on their suitability to the respective teams they are used on.

Starmie has its own versatility and value as a special spinner, with competition only from Mega Blastoise (but then you'd be giving up a Mega spot).

Ground + Steel is a better STAB combo than Water + Psychic - Starmie has to rely on BoltBeam for additional coverage, and has to drop at least one of Hydro Pump/Psyshocl/Thunderbolt/Ice Beam for Rapid Spin (and another if it wants ChoiceTrick) while Exca has EdgeQuake with Rock Slide and STAB EQ, plus Iron Head for a strong neutral hit on stuff like Latios and Landorus. Plus his primary spam move is 100% accurate as opposed to 80%. And lastly he has more relevant resists like Fairy, Flying (that one's huge), Rock (also huge), Bug, etc plus immunities to Electric and Poison. His only common weaknesses are Fighting, Ground, and Fire but he can neutralize Ground with a Balloon and he wrecks most Fires with either EQ or Rock Slide and he can abuse that since he outspeeds even some Scarfers under Sand. Starmie on the other hand has few relevant resists (Fire, Ice, Fight) and tons of common weaknesses (Dark, Bug, Ghost, Electric, Grass) and lacks crucial resists to Sucker Punch, Extreme Speed, or Brave Bird so it can be prevented from Spinning by common priority users despite its higher speed.

 

[TerraTF]

That time of the year again. Its been 3 months since the last move of Pokemon between tiers and we have had some more released today. I'll put the info from the Pastebin in a quote as well as the link to the Pastebin.

From OU to BL:
Scolipede (was previously banned in UU then rose because of usage)

From OU to UU:
Espeon
Togekiss
Diancie
Quagsire
Vaporeon
Smeargle

From UU to OU:
Gothitelle (Shadow Tag is banned in UU, not Gothitelle)
Heracross
Magnezone (was technically BL)
Mew
Slowbro

From UU to RU:
Wobbuffet (Shadow Tag is banned in UU, and thus all lower tiers)

From RU to NU:
Kabutops

From NU to RU:
Omastar
Spiritomb

These changes should be added to Pokemon Showdown and our Pokedex on-site very shortly if they haven't already been added.

Link

Some nice move from OU to UU and from UU to OU. Scolipede's fall from OU has been a long time coming since the Baton Pass nerf. Now its sitting comfortably in BL. Some big defensive Pokemon fell as well including Espeon, Vaporeon, and Quagsire. Other falls include Togekiss, Diancie, and Smeargle. I would be surprised if Espeon and Vaporeon remained in UU for long. Both have incredible staying potential, can hit very hard, and have access to one of the best Boosting moves in the game.

Now from UU to OU we have hard hitters in Magnezone and Heracross along with some defenses in Slowbro and Mew as well as a surprising support Pokemon. Gothitelle rises to OU. Likely won't stay long if a Shadow Tag ban is passed. Of the new additions I can see Mew and Magnezone fall. Mew is OU for one reason only. Its one of the best quick passers in the game with access to Swords Dance, Calm Mind, Iron Defense, Amnesia, Hone Claws, and more. Magnezone will likely fall after the next 3 months. I enjoy using Magnezone greatly but it a one trick pony that can't beat Steels named Bisharp and Heatran. Very good Pokemon to have to take down Scizor, M-Scizor, Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory but outside of that its nothing.

So what does everyone think of the new drops and additions? Anyone with experience in the lower tiers can feel free to explain why the new UU, RU, and NU additions and losses will be either good or bad.

 

[UB-01 Kenobi]

I disagree with tons of your assessment -

-Vaporeon's pretty garbage, no way will it go BL
-Mew being OU is due to it being a fantastic stallbreaker and has nothing to do with QuickPass (Smeargle is better: Geomancy + Cotton Guard)
-'Zone is an integral part if tons of offensive cores so I don't foresee him dropping


EDIT:

Spoiler

374th best player on PS!, yay. Took way too fucking long to get this alt up there after tilt and ladder decay destroyed my last main, plus I don't ladder nearly as often as I used to because most players on the ladder sort of suck so it's not as much fun as playing other people you know. Might go for #1 sometime if I have both the time and inclination. As it stands I'll probably drop off the rankings after a couple of days of decay

 

[DCM]

EDIT:

Spoiler

View attachment 95984

374th best player on PS!, yay. Took way too fucking long to get this alt up there after tilt and ladder decay destroyed my last main, plus I don't ladder nearly as often as I used to because most players on the ladder sort of suck so it's not as much fun as playing other people you know. Might go for #1 sometime if I have both the time and inclination. As it stands I'll probably drop off the rankings after a couple of days of decay

congrats dude! I want to try to go after the number one spot for UU but it's actually the meta I'm least involved with.

 

[DCM]

so my local game stop is having a tournament to celebrate ORAS and I'm thinking of making a third gen only team. I'm not even sure where to start. I'm torn between using megaman / megacham / megavoir / mega mawile (I'm kinda iffy on that last one, TBH.) I'm thinking if I run not mega gardevoir, I can use the scarf set with healing wish, if I don't run mega cham I can run the choice band set, I'm not sure after that. Help?

 

[Psycho Pacifist]

Anyone been playing PU?

I got to 1350ish in like an hour but after that it was crits, Focus Blast misses , and general bad luck.

Raichu is my favorite in the tier. After a Nasty Plot it can 2HKO the majority of the tier with Tbolt/Surf/FocusMiss coverage. Scarf set works pretty well.

 

[TerraTF]

@sharkshocker; @-Glory Blaze-;

Don't know if you saw the news but new stuff from ORAS is completely incompatible with XY. This is probably something that may need some consideration for next season of the BBL.

 

[Alexey]

I believe that we will simply be alternating between ORAS and Showdown
We won't be starting the season until weeks after ORAS release anyway (and note that we're talking European release, which means that everyone who isn't from Europe* will have an extra week to play through the games and find/breed/soft-reset whatever is needed)

*pretty much everyone here bar me and, like, 5 or 6 more people

 

[Psycho Pacifist]

How have you all been enjoying the ORAS OU on PS!?

Gunk Shot on Greninja really does live up to the hype, when it hits. You need something to beat Rotom-W assuming HP-Fire though.

M-Gallade works pretty well so far. I didn't really know the best set so I've been running Psycho Cut/CC/Poison Jab/Night Slash.
I know there are better moves than Psycho Cut and Night Slash, but Zen Headbutt kept missing and Knock Off was resisted by the new Psychic megas.

 

[TerraTF]

How have you all been enjoying the ORAS OU on PS!?

Gunk Shot on Greninja really does live up to the hype, when it hits. You need something to beat Rotom-W assuming HP-Fire though.

M-Gallade works pretty well so far. I didn't really know the best set so I've been running Psycho Cut/CC/Poison Jab/Night Slash.
I know there are better moves than Psycho Cut and Night Slash, but Zen Headbutt kept missing and Knock Off was resisted by the new Psychic megas.

I haven't gotten to playing ORAS OU on PS! yet. I'm holding off until I can play the game. Is serebii even updated for ORAS info yet?

 

[Psycho Pacifist]

Can't help you there. But I'm taking the opportunity to figure out the threats, and what can check them. It's gonna hurt when you expect your Pokémon to beat something and instead your OHKO'd by coverage moves it gained.

 

[Alexey]

Greninja was actually always able to abuse its two true counters (Sylveon and Chansey) with Spikes
It's just that now it can break them (and it becomes the ultimate jack of all trades: now you choose out of DPulse, Hydro Pump, Ice Beam, Grass Knot, HP Fire, Gunk Shot, Spikes and can basically killl anything that doesn't have priority or a scarf)

 

[UB-01 Kenobi]

Greninja was actually always able to abuse its two true counters (Sylveon and Chansey) with Spikes
It's just that now it can break them (and it becomes the ultimate jack of all trades: now you choose out of DPulse, Hydro Pump, Ice Beam, Grass Knot, HP Fire, Gunk Shot, Spikes and can basically killl anything that doesn't have priority or a scarf)

Don't forget Low Kick.

 

[Alexey]

Greninja was actually always able to abuse its two true counters (Sylveon and Chansey) with Spikes
It's just that now it can break them (and it becomes the ultimate jack of all trades: now you choose out of DPulse, Hydro Pump, Ice Beam, Grass Knot, HP Fire, Gunk Shot, Spikes and can basically killl anything that doesn't have priority or a scarf)

Don't forget Low Kick.

I didn't even know it gets it now

 

[Zyrenus]

After finding out OR/AS OU existed I decided to give it a go. I used Glory Blaze's M-Beedrill set and my, it's amazing! I got to pull off some drill runs and hard-hitting u-turns Out of the 8 battles I had so far, 5 had M-Salamence. I don't have a solid counter for it yet though. Anyone wanna share some?

 

[Psycho Pacifist]

Mamoswine is really effective so far. LO Ice Shard can destroy things like M-Beedrill, Sceptile, Altaria, and Salamence.

M-Latis are legal currently. I've only seen them on BP as a Stored Power user so far though. Curious what they can do.

 

[UB-01 Kenobi]

After finding out OR/AS OU existed I decided to give it a go. I used Glory Blaze's M-Beedrill set and my, it's amazing! I got to pull off some drill runs and hard-hitting u-turns Out of the 8 battles I had so far, 5 had M-Salamence. I don't have a solid counter for it yet though. Anyone wanna share some?

Klefki (breaks subs with Play Rough, priority T-Wave. Refresh variants can fuck you over tho), Ice Beam P2 (if you can Trace the pre-Mega Intimidate), Scarf Infiltrator Noivern (you can't switch in but you pierce Subs with your Draco and you outspeed +1 MSalamence)