Pokemon Bank

[Stratelier]

But the fact that the transporter can take pokemon OFF Gen V, and Dream Radar similarly has the ability to write ON Gen V, leads to the fair conclusion that this feature could easily have been produced for free, not tied to the bank.

That is a fair point, however GF did explain that they decided to make it a two-birds-with-one-stone approach and they probably didn't think they'd have it ready on launch day.

 

[randomspot555]

I never said that, random.

But that's where your "principle" would lead us.

But the fact that the transporter can take pokemon OFF Gen V,

Guess where it takes them to?

and Dream Radar similarly has the ability to write ON Gen V,

Irrelevant since the purpose of DR wasn't to transfer Pokemon between generations nor to store Pokemons. It is its own game which has some abilities to interact with the main games, similar to how PBR or Colosseum interacted with their respective main games during their generations.

leads to the fair conclusion that this feature could easily have been produced for free, not tied to the bank.

Yes, the whole "store Pokemon in system memory/SD card" has been debunked as an insecure way that could also very well lead to mass cloning.

Honestly, if the transfer itself is free and I just don't have to pay for the bank, then I'll retract most of my complaints. But if not, my concerns were well-founded.

I honestly wish they would release Transport by itself for free. It'll be quite funny when you find out where they actually end up getting Transported to.

Either way, this continued whining and whatnot is meaningless since there is a 30 day free trial. There's your "principle". Use it.

 

[Stratelier]

Yes, the whole "store Pokemon in system memory/SD card" has been debunked as an insecure way that could also very well lead to mass cloning.

True. Consider that if you have the downloaded version of X and Y, then your game and its save file are already stored on your SD card, and only as secure as the 3DS's overall encryption. The game manual notes that you cannot use SD card storage as a backup for your save game, but exactly what the details of this are is anyone's guess.

Irrelevant since the purpose of DR wasn't to transfer Pokemon between generations nor to store Pokemons. It is its own game which has some abilities to interact with the main games, similar to how PBR or Colosseum interacted with their respective main games during their generations.

Yeah, it only proves that 3DS apps can have some level of interaction with DS game cards, and PDR was designed to interact exclusively with those specific game cards. (I find the PBR comparison interesting because it utilized the DS as its controller/game interface -- you had a Wii and DS communicating with each other across the same wi-fi, so I'm not entirely sure why the DS and 3DS can not.)

 

[lugia61617]

But that's where your "principle" would lead us.

But the fact that the transporter can take pokemon OFF Gen V,

Guess where it takes them to?

and Dream Radar similarly has the ability to write ON Gen V,

Irrelevant since the purpose of DR wasn't to transfer Pokemon between generations nor to store Pokemons. It is its own game which has some abilities to interact with the main games, similar to how PBR or Colosseum interacted with their respective main games during their generations.

leads to the fair conclusion that this feature could easily have been produced for free, not tied to the bank.

Yes, the whole "store Pokemon in system memory/SD card" has been debunked as an insecure way that could also very well lead to mass cloning.

How exactly does saving to the system itself prove insecure when the console itself has yet to be hacked? And even then, it can have a separate encryption added if it is so insecure (again, please note: STILL NOT HACKED AND WE'RE THREE CONSOLES INTO THE ERA). Cloning can be an issue, but I'm sure with enough thought put into it, there's a way to overcome it.

Honestly, if the transfer itself is free and I just don't have to pay for the bank, then I'll retract most of my complaints. But if not, my concerns were well-founded.

I honestly wish they would release Transport by itself for free. It'll be quite funny when you find out where they actually end up getting Transported to.

Either way, this continued whining and whatnot is meaningless since there is a 30 day free trial. There's your "principle". Use it.

=_= ugh, you just don't get it...

Right, you're saying they get transported to the bank.
There's the problem!
Going to the bank means you are FORCED to pay (no matter how little it is, you still must pay for something that was free in previous games, which is unfair to the consumer). The 30 Day trial is no excuse; let's just assume I transport what I have on my Gen V carts in that time. What do I do if after that trial expires I went back to play the old games and decided to bring my best up to Gen VI? I'd have to pay which, I'll reiterate, is wrong on principle because it was free before.


The way I see it, the easiest solution is to have a free, watered-down version of the transporter. Even if it DOES use the online server temporarily, the overall amount of what is used would not warrant a payment. Let's say, 6 pokemon held maximum for transport only like in previous games. Anyone who is desperate to transport pokemon en masse would probably pay for the full service, while those who have the patience can go at the 'older' pace we are used to.

Also, why must you constantly attack me for stating my concerns with this?

 

[DasManiac]

I like the idea behind the Pokemon Bank but making people pay for it just isn't right. The ability to transfer your old Pokemon into your newer games has always been free and they have no right to charge people for the service. They also have no right to charge people for this when it simply could have been included in the cost of the game. Then of course there is the fact that the free trial will not be available past January 2014 which effectively means anyone who didn't purchase the game right away has no choice but to pay if they want to transfer there old Pokemon.

Then there's also the fact that it's not compatible with Gen IV, the first Pokemon games to utilize WI-FI. I know the Gen IV games didn't support WPA but they could have easily just made a patch available for those using the DSi or the 3Ds (xl). As its stands a consumer I have decided not to purchase to X&Y or any future titles that utilize the Pokemon Bank because if Nintendo is going to charge for very limited backwards compatibility then I'm not going to give them my money.

 

[Sneazy Sneasel]

It's 5$ a year. Unless you guys are living in poverty, why the hell are you still complaining about paying a small fee to transport Pokemon?

I like the idea behind the Pokemon Bank but making people pay for it just isn't right. The ability to transfer your old Pokemon into your newer games has always been free and they have no right to charge people for the service. They also have no right to charge people for this when it simply could have been included in the cost of the game. Then of course there is the fact that the free trial will not be available past January 2014 which effectively means anyone who didn't purchase the game right away has no choice but to pay if they want to transfer there old Pokemon.

Then there's also the fact that it's not compatible with Gen IV, the first Pokemon games to utilize WI-FI. I know the Gen IV games didn't support WPA but they could have easily just made a patch available for those using the DSi or the 3Ds (xl). As its stands a consumer I have decided not to purchase to X&Y or any future titles that utilize the Pokemon Bank because if The Pokemon Company is going to charge for very limited backwards compatibility then I'm not going to give them my money.

Fixed for you, as Nintendo has nothing to do with this.

 

[DasManiac]

It's 5$ a year. Unless you guys are living in poverty, why the hell are you still complaining about paying a small fee to transport Pokemon?

Because the simple fact is they're charging people to be able to transfer their old Pokemon when there should not be an extra fee. It should be included in the cost of the game. There's no need to charge people all of a sudden when the ability to transfer your old Pokemon has always been included in each game with the exception of FireRed and LeafGreen.

I like the idea behind the Pokemon Bank but making people pay for it just isn't right. The ability to transfer your old Pokemon into your newer games has always been free and they have no right to charge people for the service. They also have no right to charge people for this when it simply could have been included in the cost of the game. Then of course there is the fact that the free trial will not be available past January 2014 which effectively means anyone who didn't purchase the game right away has no choice but to pay if they want to transfer there old Pokemon.

Then there's also the fact that it's not compatible with Gen IV, the first Pokemon games to utilize WI-FI. I know the Gen IV games didn't support WPA but they could have easily just made a patch available for those using the DSi or the 3Ds (xl). As its stands a consumer I have decided not to purchase to X&Y or any future titles that utilize the Pokemon Bank because if The Pokemon Company is going to charge for very limited backwards compatibility then I'm not going to give them my money.

Fixed for you, as Nintendo has nothing to do with this.

I thought Nintendo was in charge of these sort of things since they own Game Freak, right?

 

[randomspot555]

How exactly does saving to the system itself prove insecure when the console itself has yet to be hacked? And even then, it can have a separate encryption added if it is so insecure (again, please note: STILL NOT HACKED AND WE'RE THREE CONSOLES INTO THE ERA). Cloning can be an issue, but I'm sure with enough thought put into it, there's a way to overcome it.

Insecure in that SD cards are not fool proof. Once an SD card or any type of portable media device fails, the data on them is pretty much gone forever. However, cloud storage on a secure server backed up several times over is secure.

Now that isn't to say it can't be done, but then you're still left with the demand that many fans have wanted of extended storage. Game Freak, for whatever reason, decided to kill two birds with one stone. And for those who have no need for extended storage or want to make a dumb "stand on principle" thing, there's a free trial.

As for the console still not being hacked, I don't want to promote it or anything, but there's evidence that those days are coming to an end, both in terms of piracy and in terms of hacking Pokemon with anecdotal reports of unavailable Pokemon in XY showing up on Random Match.

=_= ugh, you just don't get it...

I actually do. Its just the complaining has the tone of entitled whining rather than actual faults with the product at hand.

Right, you're saying they get transported to the bank.
There's the problem!
Going to the bank means you are FORCED to pay

Use the free trial.

(no matter how little it is, you still must pay for something that was free in previous games, which is unfair to the consumer).

Whoever told you "Life is fair" lied to you.

The 30 Day trial is no excuse; let's just assume I transport what I have on my Gen V carts in that time. What do I do if after that trial expires I went back to play the old games and decided to bring my best up to Gen VI? I'd have to pay which, I'll reiterate, is wrong on principle because it was free before.

Well, first off, if you have needs to use Trasport after the free trial, that sounds like a personal problem and not a problem with the product.

As for it being "free" before, sure, the actual method, but almost always required additional hardware purchases:

Gen I-2: Link cable and second system
Gen 3-4: The only real free transfer with DS/Lite
4-5: Second DS system.

With the amount of money one would've spent on "free" transferring from 4-5, you could buy something like 40+ years service of Bank.

The way I see it, the easiest solution is to have a free, watered-down version of the transporter. Even if it DOES use the online server temporarily, the overall amount of what is used would not warrant a payment. Let's say, 6 pokemon held maximum for transport only like in previous games. Anyone who is desperate to transport pokemon en masse would probably pay for the full service, while those who have the patience can go at the 'older' pace we are used to.

It frankly doesn't matter if you use Bank storage for 5 minutes or 5 months. Either way, the servers and the apps themselves still need to be maintained and updated and people doing that need to be paid and have the proper resources and etc... and that cost doesn't change. Your suggestion of a "watered down" service doesn't actually change anything other thn Game Freak eating the cost or passing it on to paying customers, which again, we're back to the entitlement mindset.

Also, why must you constantly attack me for stating my concerns with this?

Because this is a discussion forum. If you think someone replying to you in the form of discussion is "attack[ing]", grow thicker skin.

The ability to transfer your old Pokemon into your newer games has always been free

False.

and they have no right to charge people for the service.

They had to develop an entirely separate app and plan on keeping the app updated to carry on with future releases. How else do you expect them to pay for this additional, ongoing expense?

They also have no right to charge people for this when it simply could have been included in the cost of the game.

The games themselves do not have the ability to communicate with Gen 5 games. There's nothing that could've been included to do so.

Then of course there is the fact that the free trial will not be available past January 2014 which effectively means anyone who didn't purchase the game right away has no choice but to pay if they want to transfer there old Pokemon.

That sounds like a personal problem. I would imagine the vast majority of people who have older games to transfer stuff from are fans of Pokemon, fan enough that they'd easily have the game by Christmas, if not sooner.

Then there's also the fact that it's not compatible with Gen IV, the first Pokemon games to utilize WI-FI. I know the Gen IV games didn't support WPA but they could have easily just made a patch available for those using the DSi or the 3Ds (xl). As its stands a consumer I have decided not to purchase to X&Y or any future titles that utilize the Pokemon Bank because if Nintendo is going to charge for very limited backwards compatibility then I'm not going to give them my money.

Anyone who was delusional enough to think there'd ever be a way to transfer straight from 4-6 is delusional and only has themselves to blame.

But I do admire your dedication. Most of the complainers, whiners, and conspiracy theorists, despite their whining and complaining, seem to have purchased XY within the first two weeks. I admire that you're at least sticking to your guns.

 

[Sneazy Sneasel]

It's 5$ a year. Unless you guys are living in poverty, why the hell are you still complaining about paying a small fee to transport Pokemon?

Because the simple fact is they're charging people to be able to transfer their old Pokemon when there should not be an extra fee. It should be included in the cost of the game. There's no need to charge people all of a sudden when the ability to transfer your old Pokemon has always been included in each game with the exception of FireRed and LeafGreen.

I like the idea behind the Pokemon Bank but making people pay for it just isn't right. The ability to transfer your old Pokemon into your newer games has always been free and they have no right to charge people for the service. They also have no right to charge people for this when it simply could have been included in the cost of the game. Then of course there is the fact that the free trial will not be available past January 2014 which effectively means anyone who didn't purchase the game right away has no choice but to pay if they want to transfer there old Pokemon.

Then there's also the fact that it's not compatible with Gen IV, the first Pokemon games to utilize WI-FI. I know the Gen IV games didn't support WPA but they could have easily just made a patch available for those using the DSi or the 3Ds (xl). As its stands a consumer I have decided not to purchase to X&Y or any future titles that utilize the Pokemon Bank because if The Pokemon Company is going to charge for very limited backwards compatibility then I'm not going to give them my money.

Fixed for you, as Nintendo has nothing to do with this.

I thought Nintendo was in charge of these sort of things since they own Game Freak, right?

Nintendo doesn't own Game Freak nor do they have full ownership of the Pokemon franchise the Pokemon Company are the ones who call the shots. Nintendo's involvement with Pokemon is nothing more than licensing.

 

[randomspot555]

To end the derail:

The rights to Pokemon are divided three ways: Game Freak (makes the main games), Creatures Inc (handles trading cards and I think some other merchandising as well), and Nintendo (distributes games, can authorize other parties to make spinoff games).

The Pokemon Company is a subsidiary of Nintendo and is basically the promotions arm of the entire franchise. They run the Pokemon Centers in Japan, for example. The subsidiary of TPC, TPC International, handles or works closely with proper affiliates to translate the various aspects of the franchise into the respective languages and all that stuff.

TPC's only real involvement in the games, to the best of my knowledge, is that, prior to gen 5, they would hire free lance translators to translate the games. As of HGSS, all translation is done "in house", presumably using Nintendo's own translators. TPC is also responsible for dubbing the anime.

 

[SUP3RN0VA]

I never said that, random. But the fact that the transporter can take pokemon OFF Gen V, and Dream Radar similarly has the ability to write ON Gen V, leads to the fair conclusion that this feature could easily have been produced for free, not tied to the bank.

Honestly, if the transfer itself is free and I just don't have to pay for the bank, then I'll retract most of my complaints. But if not, my concerns were well-founded.

If Pokemon Transporter were a standalone app, Gamefreak would most likely require an annual fee for that too. The reason why Pokemon bank has an annual fee is to keep up the maintenance. The exact same thing would be required with Pokemon transporter. Gamefreak actually did us a favour by joining them together and only paying a fee for one app. The alternative would have been to be charged an annual fee for two separate apps, and I am sure you wouldn't be too fond of that.

I like the idea behind the Pokemon Bank but making people pay for it just isn't right. The ability to transfer your old Pokemon into your newer games has always been free and they have no right to charge people for the service. They also have no right to charge people for this when it simply could have been included in the cost of the game. Then of course there is the fact that the free trial will not be available past January 2014 which effectively means anyone who didn't purchase the game right away has no choice but to pay if they want to transfer there old Pokemon.

Then there's also the fact that it's not compatible with Gen IV, the first Pokemon games to utilize WI-FI. I know the Gen IV games didn't support WPA but they could have easily just made a patch available for those using the DSi or the 3Ds (xl). As its stands a consumer I have decided not to purchase to X&Y or any future titles that utilize the Pokemon Bank because if Nintendo is going to charge for very limited backwards compatibility then I'm not going to give them my money.

Gamefreak have every right to charge us whatever they need to. It is their games, they created them, and they therefore have the right to do whatever needs to be done. The alternative would be to not have a transfer system at all, and that would have made a lot more people angry.

 

[lugia61617]

Just because you create something does not give you the right to spit in the face of your consumers by charging extra for something you have always provided for free.

Also random, I did get X and Y because I had faith that there would still be an alternative. Unfortunately there isn't one, which is my largest gripe with the games. My decision to get these games was not influenced by my disdain for the methods. Oh, and I didn't say anything about direct IV to VI transfer. As for the 'personal' problem, actually I've seen a great number of people who still play the older games for recreation at any point. Again, what happens to those people who will then be barred fram transferring without an arbitrary and unfair additional payment.

 

[SUP3RN0VA]

Just because you create something does not give you the right to spit in the face of your consumers by charging extra for something you have always provided for free.

Also random, you little pest and persecutor, I did get X and Y because I had faith that there would still be an alternative. Unfortunately there isn't one, which is my largest gripe with the games. My decision to get these games was not influenced by my disdain for the methods. Oh, and I didn't say anything about direct IV to VI transfer. As for the 'personal' problem, actually I've seen a great number of people who still play the older games for recreation at any point. Again, what happens to those people who will then be barred fram transferring without an arbitrary and unfair additional payment.

What do you expect Gamefreak to do? Disappoint even more fans by not having no feature to transfer Pokemon at all? And yes it does give them the right. It gives them every right. They have every right to do what they want or need to do. If they had no right to do it, they wouldn't do it.

Unfair additional payment? They NEED the funding in order to keep the app running. No annual fee = no app. It's your choice on whether you'd prefer Pokemon Bank with Pokemon transporter, or no transfer feature at all.

 

[lugia61617]

Sometimes I wonder why I bother when people don't seem to grasp the point that the consumer is the priority.
Guess what? If it didn't use online features, which it didn't have to, it could easily have been free. The extreme degree here is "Pay or no transfer" and that is wrong and utterly reprehensible. And what will happen if GF goes under at some point, however unlikely it is? Instant loss of any transfer ability from gen V upwards. This doesn't bode well at the moment, nor for the future.

 

[SUP3RN0VA]

Sometimes I wonder why I bother when people don't seem to grasp the point that the consumer is the priority.
Guess what? If it didn't use online features, which it didn't have to, it could easily have been free. The extreme degree here is "Pay or no transfer" and that is wrong and utterly reprehensible. And what will happen if GF goes under at some point, however unlikely it is? Instant loss of any transfer ability from gen V upwards. This doesn't bode well at the moment, nor for the future.

That's right, the consumer is the priority, and I am certain a lot more people would have been annoyed if there was no transfer feature at all than an optional feature that only costs $5 a year. No it couldn't have been free. The app exists for now and for the future, which is why an annual fee is required, so that maintenance can be kept and the app doesn't become unusable. This long term goal is there to solve all future problems that may occur, like it had once already.

I don't even see why it is a problem. If it wasn't for this app, you'd have to spend hundreds to get a second console just to transfer Pokemon. You're saving a lot more money this way than if transfering Pokemon the previous way was an option.

If Gamefreak goes down, you'll have a much bigger problem than not being able to transfer Pokemon.

 

[lugia61617]

Ugh, that's it; I'm outta here. people like you remind me why exactly I abandoned this community in the first place. You're stubborn and don't understand why what Game Freak is doing here is wrong!

 

[SUP3RN0VA]

Ugh, that's it; I'm outta here. people like you remind me why exactly I abandoned this community in the first place. You're stubborn and don't understand why what Game Freak is doing here is wrong!

No, you're the stubborn one. What YOU are doing is wrong. Gamefreak have found a long term solution to allow us loyal fans to keep our cherished Pokemon, and you have the nerve to refer to them in negative manners just because you personally don't want to cough up $5 a year. Clearly you're the one who doesn't understand, as you cannot open your mind enough to the possibility that Gamefreak had no other choice. I'd love to see you create an app that is intended to exist as long as possible, while needing a constant source of funds in order to maintain it, and charge absolutely nothing for it. If you can't do that, don't expect anyone else to.

Accusing others of being stubborn when you're the one not opening their mind wide enough just looks rather sad.

 

[Heredity]

brb guys let me fetch another AU$150 for a 2DS, just so that I can transfer some digital 'mons. I mean, it's about 30 years worth of Pokemon Bank... No, that might not be such a good idea.

 

[randomspot555]

Just because you create something does not give you the right to spit in the face of your consumers

If the consumer is as entitled as you, it sure does.

by charging extra for something you have always provided for free.

This is false.

Also random, you little pest and persecutor, I did get X and Y because I had faith that there would still be an alternative. Unfortunately there isn't one, which is my largest gripe with the games. My decision to get these games was not influenced by my disdain for the methods.

Again, personal problem. But it was well known that Bank would be the only way.

Oh, and I didn't say anything about direct IV to VI transfer.

That's nice. If you bothered to read my post, you'd notice I was addressing someone else.

As for the 'personal' problem, actually I've seen a great number of people who still play the older games for recreation at any point. Again, what happens to those people who will then be barred fram transferring without an arbitrary and unfair additional payment.

Pokemon games can be fully enjoyed out of the box and transfer is not vital to the gaming experience. If they don't have the additional software and/or hardware available to do whatever type of generational transfer, that is unfortunate. But it should be noted that at the price they'd pay for a Link Cable for 1-2 transfer, they'd be able to pay for four years of Bank service.

 

[Norzan]

The people complaining about that transfering from Gen 5 to 6 should be free and it was always "free" do not really understand what they are trying to do with this. I'm pretty sure they created the Pokemon Bank just not for Gen 6 but also for the following generations, it means you don't have to buy an extra 3DS in Gen 7 to transfer you Gen 6 pokemon. Also transfering pokemon in the previous generations was never "free", i had to buy an extra DS to transfer my Gen 4 pokemon to my White version and if they created this feature at that time i wouldn't had to buy another DS and instead used that money to pay for the annual Pokemon Bank fee.