[SPOILERS] Alola Pokemon and Alola Variant Competitive Viability (Story Free Spoilers)

[The Outrage]

Bewear can survive CB Mega Rayquaza's Dragon Ascent...

@Envoy
Tapu Bulu pairs well with Drought Torkoal who is arguably a better sun setter than Ninetales. Good physical bulk, Grassy Terrain, and Sun means it takes out two of its weaknesses. Shell Smash isn't going to be that great, but it'll have utility as a Stealth Rock/Spinner/Sun setter.

 

[Matleo]

Deci's not tanky enough to reliably use Toucannon's signature move.

really with that defence 75? and hp 78?
I think it would be a good move for it and for Empoleon.
Atleast it would make up for Will-O-wisp and remember that not every oponent will know your team, how to predict team and moveset of oponent taking this amount of pokemon?
Imagine a combo with Hex if Decidueye would get it?

Why would people have complained if Deci got a better Speed stat than Venu and Blaze? That's what we all wanted.

still with this speed its a very good pokemon that only needs suport in team and a little buff of own moveset,
Dream Eater and Sleep Powder/Hipnosis would be a good option to buff its movepool.
Thousand Arrows would be also great (this one could have been 70BP and priority to the effect of hitting flying foes)


Where is Assist on any of the starters?

 

[Envoy]

Bewear can survive CB Mega Rayquaza's Dragon Ascent...

@Envoy
Tapu Bulu pairs well with Drought Torkoal who is arguably a better sun setter than Ninetales. Good physical bulk, Grassy Terrain, and Sun means it takes out two of its weaknesses. Shell Smash isn't going to be that great, but it'll have utility as a Stealth Rock/Spinner/Sun setter.

Dear God Bewear is bulky as all get out then.

Yeah, Torkoal is probably the better partner for Bulu. In addition to that, Grassy Terrain essentially neuters Ground type moves, which is something Fire types appreciate. Still sucks that Torkoal itself is weak to Stealth Rocks, but between Sun and G-Terrain, two of its weaknesses are essentially gone.

really with that defence 75? and hp 78?
I think it would be a good move for it and for Empoleon.
Atleast it would make up for Will-O-wisp and remember that not every oponent will know your team, how to predict team and moveset of oponent taking this amount of pokemon?
Imagine a combo with Hex if Decidueye would get it?

These defenses aren't exactly something to write home about. I will grant you that getting pseudo Will-o-Wisp sounds nice in theory, but having to take a hit in order to activate it hurts.

still with this speed its a very good pokemon that only needs support in team and a little buff of own moveset,
Dream Eater and Sleep Powder/Hypnosis would be a good option to buff its movepool.
Thousand Arrows would be also great (this one could have been 70BP and priority to the effect of hitting flying foes)


Where is Assist on any of the starters?

70 Speed is not very good. In fact, it's actually pretty terrible. It's just this side of too fast to fit in a Trick Room team but too slow to make use of its offenses.

 

[Matleo]

70 Speed is not very good. In fact, it's actually pretty terrible. It's just this side of too fast to fit in a Trick Room team but too slow to make use of its offenses.

some what true but maybe a hidden ability will solve even that problem?
we dont know what they have more in store for us in next generations, maybe they have a bigger picture in next 5 generations that will come?
If it gets in future Bounce, Fly, Shadow Sneak it will be better dont forget we have Z-moves and in future they may get better Mega forms.

Shadow Snek Z-move? maybe they feared over use of that on Decidueye?
But they always could make Primarina learn Psychic Terrain or Queenly majesty?
Or Incineroar could get Dazzling?

 

[Envoy]

some what true but maybe a hidden ability will solve even that problem?
we dont know what they have more in store for us in next generations, maybe they have a bigger picture in next 5 generations that will come?
If it gets in future Bounce, Fly, Shadow Sneak it will be better dont forget we have Z-moves and in future they may get better Mega forms.

Shadow Snek Z-move? maybe they feared over use of that on Decidueye?
But they always could make Primarina learn Psychic Terrain or Queenly majesty?
Or Incineroar could get Dazzling?

We already know their hidden abilities. Long Reach, Intimidate, and Liquid Voice. None of them do anything to patch up the Starters' speed.

We can't just sit here twiddling our thumbs and hoping for 'what ifs.' We need to work with what we got. And in the case of the Starters, what we got isn't enough for OU.

Bounce, Fly, Phantom Force and other such moves are usually seen as bad competitively because they telegraph your next move for the opponent, which gives them the freedom to counter you whichever way they like, not only shifting momentum to their side, but possibly costing you a Pokémon.

 

[Matleo]

We already know their hidden abilities

had secondary on mind.

Long Reach

Now we got a pokemon immune also to Aftermath and Cursed Body? am I right?
Fluffy, Gooey, Mummy, Cute charm, Poison Point,Static, Flame Body

Shell trap, Banebull Buncker, Spiky Shield.

People underestimate Decidueye.
Look at this:

Contact - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

If Tail Wind comes in then havoc will break loose. (we dont have a pokemon who could cast it like weather???)
-Omnious wind=all stat rise up

Better let us discuss what pokemon can Decidueye counter without any problems?
Lucario has now a formidable oponent next to Chesnaught?

Bounce, Fly, Phantom Force and other such moves are usually seen as bad competitively because they telegraph your next move for the opponent, which gives them the freedom to counter you whichever way they like, not only shifting momentum to their side, but possibly costing you a Pokémon.

In future that could also change. The greates problem with them is the priority and that you can't change the attack you make, but what if you could easly swith out on the turn it dissapers? if on comand?

They would be better if moves like Volt Tackle would take damage and moves like Frenzly Plant cause to loose a turn when "missing" them.

Thats maybe why Decidueye can trap it's foe. They plan on modifiing their movesets probably in next games.
The same reason Primarina didnt get Dragon Tail.
Imagine Incineroar with Burn Up.
And so on they want to know probably first what players think before the next modifications will take place.

 

[Gengarzilla]

Any thoughts on how Ribombee would hold up? Nearly outspeeds Weavile at 124 Speed, has a good 95 Special Attack, and learns Quiver Dance. The movepool's a bit lacking though but that hasn't stopped other Pokémon before.

 

[The Outrage]

We can't just sit here twiddling our thumbs and hoping for 'what ifs.' We need to work with what we got. And in the case of the Starters, what we got isn't enough for OU.

ever notice how the regions based on American states have the competitively worst starters

Spoiler

Gen V had Serperior, but its HA wasn't released until Gen VI so it doesn't count

 

[Matleo]

Any thoughts on how Ribombee would hold up? Nearly outspeeds Weavile at 124 Speed, has a good 95 Special Attack, and learns Quiver Dance. The movepool's a bit lacking though but that hasn't stopped other Pokémon before.

we have a realy good dragon/dark counter.

 

[Envoy]

ever notice how the regions based on American states have the competitively worst starters

Spoiler

Gen V had Serperior, but its HA wasn't released until Gen VI so it doesn't count

Orre had the Johto Starters.....

...yay?

 

[The Outrage]

I was thinking of ways Tapu Bulu could be good in doubles...there's the obvious pairing with Comfey but I think this set up would be nice:

Tapu Bulu @Eject Button
Ability: Grassy Terrain
- Leech Seed
- Horn Leech
- Swords Dance
- ???

Comfey @Leftovers
Ability: Triage
- Trick Room
- Floral Healing
- Synthesis/Protect/Grassy Terrain/Light Screen/Nature Power
- Draining Kiss

Wishiwashi @Waterium-Z
Ability: Schooling
- Endeavor
- Hydro Pump/Water Fall
- U-turn
- Ice Beam/Return

I don't know who the fourth team member is, but the basic strategy is to set up Trick Room and Grassy Terrain on the first turn. Unfortunately Tapu Bulu doesn't have U-turn so I'd stick with Eject Button, potentially letting me attack while getting a free switch. Turn 2, assuming there's no Pokemon to redirect water, Hydrovortex comng off of Wishiwashi will help with a near instant KO. Since Wishiwashi has low HP, Endeavor is a good choice for lowering particularly bulky Pokemon's health. If it can't handle a Pokemon, there's always U-turning back to Tapu Bulu. Comfey on the other hand plays support and uses Floral Healing (powered up by Grassy Terrain) to keep Wishiwashi in schooling form

Orre had the Johto Starters.....

...yay?

It had them available, but wasn't the starters. Also isn't a main series game developed by Game Freak...and purely by Smogon tiers, they technically averaged as the "worst" in Gen III

 

[Guzma]

To be honest, I can't see the Gen VII starters going anywhere below RU at worst.

• Prima's got great typing, the spec. defense to back said typing up and fantastic spec. attack.
  
• Inci's got an insane movepool, decent typing, Prankster immunity, good physical bulk and a classic ability that's stood the test of time.
• Deci's a utility 'mon that's able to trap while also being immune to traps, and is able to pivot, spinblock and clear hazards. It's also a phys. attacker that's able to completely ignore Rocky Helmet, abilities like Rough Skin and Static (good GOD I hate Static) and moves like King's Shield, Spiky Shield or Baneful Bunker.

Plus, they'll eventually get more moves from Move Tutors in either a third version or (like in Gen VI) the Sinnoh remakes.

 

[winstein]

It's interesting to see how Alolan Marowak has seen success in the preliminary stages in the battle simulators. The main draw with Marowak is the high Attack with Thick Club, which the Alolan Marowak thankfully benefits from also, but the most important quality Alolan Marowak possesses is its resistances. With 9 resistances/immunities and an extra Electric one with Lightning Rod, it has a lot of opportunities to check some new threats like Pheromosa and Xurkitree.

Of course, the dual Fire/Ghost STAB is not to be underestimated, since it has Flare Blitz and Shadow Bone (85 BP, 20% chance to reduce target's Defence), along with Earthquake/Bonemarang for coverage. That 3-move coverage is essentially only resisted by Hydreigon, which is impressive. This leaves it with a decent amount of options like Stealth Rock, Swords Dance or even Will-O-Wisp, so for now it is a much better version of the original Marowak.

Certainly, it's got a weakness to 5 types, but 10 resistances is still impressive on something that's not a Steel-type.

Thanks for reading.

 

[Envoy]

Marowak is used as a way to check Aegislash and Pheromosa. A shaky check at that. Once those two get banned, which looks likely, Marowak's novelty will likely dissipate.

 

[Spectre Of The Departed]

Too bad Alolan Marowak's speed is irremadiably low or else Flame Charge could be an interesting option to patch that stat up a bit. With that in mind, I personally prefer Rock Head on it because since you'll be going to take a hit first most of the time, might as well not wear yourself down further with recoil. Not to mention that even though the Electric type immunity can be a nice thing to have, A-Marowak can't really make use of the Sp.Atk. boosts it provides.

 

[Matleo]

Too bad Alolan Marowak's speed is irremadiably low or else Flame Charge could be an interesting option to patch that stat up a bit. With that in mind, I personally prefer Rock Head on it because since you'll be going to take a hit first most of the time, might as well not wear yourself down further with recoil. Not to mention that even though the Electric type immunity can be a nice thing to have, A-Marowak can't really make use of the Sp.Atk. boosts it provides.

It depends against what it needs to fight.

 

[Envoy]

It depends against what it needs to fight.

Nope. They're right. Sp. Atk is wasted on Marowak-A

 

[UB-01 Kenobi]

Agreed that the SpA boosts are useless, but Lightningrod is by far the better ability on AMarowak. Lets it out a HARD stop to Tapu Koko, Xurkitree, etc

 

[Matleo]

Nope. They're right. Sp. Atk is wasted on Marowak-A

special Z-moves also? it depends from the strategy.

 

[Envoy]

special Z-moves also? it depends from the strategy.

No fully evolved Pokemon with a base special attack stat of 50 is worth using on the special side. And none of the Z-Moves and Lightningrod power ups in the world are going to change that.