Discussion: Story-writing and storytelling of Pokemon games

[CrystaI]

Regarding on the BW story plot, basically it is still the same badge quest + villainous team plot. However, it is good because many important characters are nicely flesh out, having their individuality which can be seen from their conversations. And about the overall goal of Team Plasma, undoubtedly it is a nice idea which will arouse the moral question of many people, not limited to in-universe characters but also the players outside the 4th wall. Finally, the ending surprised you by not just simply becoming league champion, but the final confrontation with Team Plasma.

Like I said, it was not the badge quest + villainous team formula be the problem, but it is the overall execution and the storytelling is the problem.

 

[Beth Pavell]

I thought the BW story was frankly half-finished. Everyone always mentions the question of whether N was right, but there are some crucial elements missing in that idea. We didn't even really know if pokémon were sentient in the game, or how much pain they felt from battling, whether the standard Poké Ball was an imposition to them, or whether they liked fighting. In fact, for all that N believed he was on the side of pokémon, he didn't seem to know very much about what they actually wanted at all (Reminds me somewhat of Hermione and the House Elves, that)

A much more interesting question- though too complex for a game intended to have appeal across a very wide age range - would be whether freedom means the same to a pokémon as it does to a human

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

Regarding on the BW story plot, basically it is still the same badge quest + villainous team plot. However, it is good because many important characters are nicely flesh out, having their individuality which can be seen from their conversations. And about the overall goal of Team Plasma, undoubtedly it is a nice idea which will arouse the moral question of many people, not limited to in-universe characters but also the players outside the 4th wall. Finally, the ending surprised you by not just simply becoming league champion, but the final confrontation with Team Plasma.

Like I said, it was not the badge quest + villainous team formula be the problem, but it is the overall execution and the storytelling is the problem.

I'm not disagreeing, but that's partially why I got bored in the beginning.
There is nothing wrong with the current formula and adding additional story content doesn't have to mean changing the formula.
They could change the formula and still be bad at story telling because they don't develop characters well or explain things appropriately.

The key elements to story telling are: well developed characters, a plot, and a sequence of events and interactions between the characters.

When I say that having multiple storylines or endings would be nice, that's my opinion. It would bring in a breath of fresh air. Plus, having a villain that isn't so easily identifiable as the villain might be nice. They tried this with Lysandre, who was a close friend of the regional professor, but, let's face it, most of us probably guessed fairly early on he was the bad guy.

*shrugs*

I'll go back to my moment calculations now and leave you guys alone.

 

[Beth Pavell]

Plus, having a villain that isn't so easily identifiable as the villain might be nice. They tried this with Lysandre, who was a close friend of the regional professor, but, let's face it, most of us probably guessed fairly early on he was the bad guy.

I quite agree. Half the problem is that it's always the same characters who have a costume among the sea of ordinary NPCs. If a character has fancy clothes or kool hair, you already know they're probably going to be either a rival, a Gym Leader, an Elite For member or a villain

 

[tyguy723]

This isn't directly related to the story/plot of the game involving the world around the character, but does anyone else miss the journal key item that told you what you did last in the game if you didn't play it for more than 2 days?

I always liked it because I felt like it gave an interesting take on your player character's story rather than the standard defeat the evil team blah blah...

 

[Det]

A plot idea is they clearly hint someone grumpy and stereotypical as the villain, but the good looking and friendly guy that induces you to mistrust him, is actually the bad guy.

A key item tolding your journey would be nice, but would make sense just if your choices make a difference, otherwise wouldn't make sense tell always the same story.

 

[SquadalaGuy]

A plot idea is they clearly hint someone grumpy and stereotypical as the villain, but the good looking and friendly guy that induces you to mistrust him, is actually the bad guy.

A key item tolding your journey would be nice, but would make sense just if your choices make a difference, otherwise wouldn't make sense tell always the same story.

That's what you would call "pulling of a Dusknoir 'n' Grovyle twist".

 

[EmpoleonProd]

ORAS by far had some of the best plot. I love the new lore about the new universe like the Delta Episode.

 

[Maniacal Engineer]

I quite agree. Half the problem is that it's always the same characters who have a costume among the sea of ordinary NPCs. If a character has fancy clothes or kool hair, you already know they're probably going to be either a rival, a Gym Leader, an Elite For member or a villain

I believe chuggaaconroy once said that it is an unspoken rule that the kid with the dumbest hat in the land becomes the Champion.

 

[Pyrax]

A plot idea is they clearly hint someone grumpy and stereotypical as the villain, but the good looking and friendly guy that induces you to mistrust him, is actually the bad guy.

Not saying the main series games have innovative plots, but that would be incredibly cliché, even for GameFreak. What GF needs to do is hire more innovative writers who're not afraid to give depth to important characters (aside from the villains) and break the mold that only Gen V's broken away from. This is precisely why BW are my favourite entries plot-wise - XY was a couple of steps back that Z/X2Y2 needs to rectify imo.

 

[Almonds]

I quite agree. Half the problem is that it's always the same characters who have a costume among the sea of ordinary NPCs. If a character has fancy clothes or kool hair, you already know they're probably going to be either a rival, a Gym Leader, an Elite For member or a villain

The thought of having someone ordinary looking as the villain/rival is pretty hilarious, but it would be rather underwhelming if an important character looked just like any NPC you see on a random route.
Professor Cozmo is given a simple scientist model in ORAS. He's involved with the Meteorite plot and the Delta Episode AND has a special backstory regarding Sea Mauville, and I was wondering why he hasn't been given a unique design if he's heavily involved with the story.

 

[KrisiChiki]

I think what would work best is simply a disguise, like Curtiss/Yancy in BW2 and then have a fancy design when they are in their villain team suit.

How about a villain leader that is actually the champion? What about a villain team with its top members (admins etc.) all being part of the Pokemon League (Elite four & Champion) which is why you have to try so hard to become a strong trainer; to defeat them! We could even go further and have a group of Pokemon that are mind controlling humans with their Psychic abilities making them seem as the villains (like those Malamar in XY).

What if the mother is actually the champion and she encourages the player to go out on a journey because she did the same when she was their age? Then they fight the villain team alongside the mother (or any family member for the matter)? Alternatively, what if the mother is a contest/movie celebrity and dislikes Pokemon battles so the player runs away from home and collects badges to prove something?

How about the Professor being the villain team leader? He/She is actually searching for talented young trainers to add them to his/her team by manipulating them in a similar manner as Lysandre did to Alain in the Mega Evolution specials. The player eventually discovers the Professor's true intentions.

All these things aren't really impressive writing, but they would be a nice change of pace for the games.

 

[Kynn Master]

^ Nice plots you gave there.

I think the biggest problem here is the protagonist. They never explain why they set in an adventure, I think only the first game had a reasonable excuse: fill the pokedex for Oak and that's it. Why would those kids do that, because that's what the cool kids do? You get a Pokemon and journey your region to try being the best?

The villains also annoy me a bit, aside from Team Rocket, every team just seems to want a powerful legendary Pokemon and do what the Pokemon is capable to do. How they decide the goals at GAMEFREAK? Do they design the version mascot and be like: "what this Pokemon will do? Control the land? So let's make the villainous team expand the land. Seems like an awesome idea!"

Where decreasing the sea level is a good idea? Unless you want to control all the water in the world and become filthy rich doing so, nothing.

 

[godiego]

I think the biggest problem here is the protagonist. They never explain why they set in an adventure, I think only the first game had a reasonable excuse: fill the pokedex for Oak and that's it. Why would those kids do that, because that's what the cool kids do? You get a Pokemon and journey your region to try being the best?

Gen I has Oak asking you to complete the Pokedex (because why not), Gen II has Elm asking you to deliver the egg and then you sort of secondarily are encouraged to take on the gym challenge, Gen III has you wanting to face your father and also go on an adventure, Gen IV has Rowan asking you to complete the Pokedex, and iirc Gen V and VI you are just setting out on an adventure with your friends.

 

[Beth Pavell]

Aside from the "complete the pokédex" plots, the reasons are pretty flimsy. This is where the medium is a limitation in itself - the protagonist is supposed to be pretty much a blank slate for players to project themselves onto. I like it that way, but it does mean that there's only so much that can be done with the story as a consequence

 

[godiego]

Aside from the "complete the pokédex" plots, the reasons are pretty flimsy. This is where the medium is a limitation in itself - the protagonist is supposed to be pretty much a blank slate for players to project themselves onto. I like it that way, but it does mean that there's only so much that can be done with the story as a consequence

tbh i'd say the reason why the story in Pokemon is so bland is largely because the regions aren't big enough to accommodate the size and depth of story that players want without having to backtrack a lot.

 

[Master Cyrus]

tbh i'd say the reason why the story in Pokemon is so bland is largely because the regions aren't big enough to accommodate the size and depth of story that players want without having to backtrack a lot.

They had two whole regions in the Johto games and the storyline was still flimsier than that of BW which literally had no fluff in the entire region. You went from gym to gym to gym starting from striaton all the way to the elite four without any filler towns in between.

 

[Icy Wind]

They had two whole regions in the Johto games and the storyline was still flimsier than that of BW which literally had no fluff in the entire region. You went from gym to gym to gym starting from striaton all the way to the elite four without any filler towns in between.

...........?
There is no ''filler'' town in the johto games between each gym, just new bark town and cherrygrove city and after that, every city/town has a gym.

 

[godiego]

They had two whole regions in the Johto games and the storyline was still flimsier than that of BW which literally had no fluff in the entire region. You went from gym to gym to gym starting from striaton all the way to the elite four without any filler towns in between.

because they made Kanto the post-game. and as pointed out by above, there aren't any filler towns in Johto after Cherrygrove. ultimately if you try to incorporate more story it'd likely end up like BW where there is just an onslaught of story event after story event, many of them essentially empty and filler (eg., Cheren when you get to Nacrene, Chargestone Cave, Skyla).

 

[Daren]

To some extent I think the games stories suffer from having two stories since having both the League challenge and the Evil Team means neither get fully fleshed out. BW did it differently of course (confession: I skipped Gen 5 so I can't give an in-depth analysis on it). Gen 1 and 2 were a little different in that Team Rocket weren't an apocalyptic threat like many of the later Teams were. They still had the "why hasn't anyone dealt with these bozos?" problem, arguably made worse by that NPC in Saffron City talking about how he wishes the Elite Four would come and stop them, with the game never explaining why they don't.

One hurdle the games have is that the way your party works means they can't give your companions any sort of characterization, so the NPCs would have to pick up the slack--but everyone's characterization is usually fairly thin--there've been a few memorable lines (usually for being really silly) but none of the characters are really memorable for their personality or anything like that.
I think your friends in XY were an attempt to sort of work around this by giving you something resembling traveling companions, but they were all kind of boring (except for the unintentional comedy of just how terrible Trevor and Rival were at accomplishing their goals)

So I'd suggest one game should try either combining the two into the popular "Champion IS the leader of Team X" idea, or dropping one of the two storylines (to some extent the Gamecube RPGs were kind of that--no league, just an evil team).