4Kids would also have edited out the infamous panty shot from "Pikachu's in Charge/Steamboat Willies" even though it only flashes by for less than a second.
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First 2008 Title (it seems)
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4Kids would also have edited out the infamous panty shot from "Pikachu's in Charge/Steamboat Willies" even though it only flashes by for less than a second.
The Big Al
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Her skirt would have been longer as others have said.
You know, I don't know if they'd bother editing Dawn's skirt much if 4Kids was still dubbing it- her skirt's short enough for them to want to edit it in every scene, instead of the occasional times they did with Jesse's when it just happened to seem shorter or the pose. Doesn't it take more money anyway to do an edit, let alone the time? I don't know if they could've afforded continuously editing it?
Random thought.
Random thought.
Check Dogasu's comparisons, 4Kids began editing out cleavage sometime ago (Musashi primarily, but I also believe they did it on that flashback with Haruka's mom at the beach). Eventually it got to the point where the Japanese version just didn't add it. Outfits that definitely should've had cleavage just didn't.
Now the "breast lines" have suddenly reappeared in one of the newest episodes.
Now the "breast lines" have suddenly reappeared in one of the newest episodes.
I read Dogasu's site, and I remember... maybe three episode where cleavage was edited? Four? That's out of several hundred episodes.
The kind of people who notice how long it's been since we last saw a flash of tit, I suppose.
Pokemon has hardly ever had boob shots, at any point in its history, under 4kids or PUSA. If six months or so should happen to pass without a glimpse down some girl's top, might I suggest that's a result of Pokemon being a children's TV show, rather than 4kids the Evil Tyrants Against Fanservice? (You'd think if the latter was the case, May would have had a normal cup-size from day 1.)
...According to who?
The kind of people who notice how long it's been since we last saw a flash of tit, I suppose.
Ahhh, breast lines today, hardcore nudity by 2008. All hail PUSA.
Jo-Jo, there's no need to be smart. You're totally missing the point. If 4kids will edit out cleavage and lengthen skirts, why WOULDN'T they lengthen Hikari's skirt? Even some of the perverts around here were shocked when we saw how short it was.
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Ralli said:
That has never, ever been a problem to 4Kids. Just look at the hundreds of pointlesspaint edits in their version of One Piece. It got to the point, with that show, that they were going around erasing anime sweatdrops and the cartoony veins that pop up on angry people's foreheads. Money was obviously not an issue there.
Jo-Jo said:
There was a Battle Frontier episode where everyone went to the beach (maybe it was the Pokemon Contest with Kate?) where they had all these women wearing low-cut bikini tops. Yet there wasn't a single line of cleavage in the entire episode.
According to anyone who's ever seen a woman wearing a shirt that's not buttoned up all the way.
Commenting on how the cleavage on the show went away for a while isn't some fanboy craving to see animated tit. It's just a comment on how something that used to be there went away. You're acting like we're all asking to see full-on female nudity in a children's show or something.
I think what Jo-Jo is trying to say is that 4kids is continually bashed in this fandom, but PUSA seems to have been given a free pass just because they aren’t 4kids. 4kids was hated for good reason and when they messed up everybody was quick to jump on them (which they should have), but when PUSA messes up people seem to turn a blind eye or try to make excuses for them (instead of bashing them which is what they deserve). When you continue to see statements like what I saw on sppf the other day and I quote “I just wish we had all of the original soundtrack (at least its a vast improvement).” Then you know PUSA has been given a free pass by name alone, because they sure as heck haven’t kept enough music to be considered a “vast improvement”. People don’t seem to be willing to admit that’s the same freaking dub, and it hasn’t really gotten any better, not enough for you to say “Wow this dub is so much different!”. We still have butchered music, God and any references to Religion continue to be taboo, they still rewrite the scripts at their own whim, they cut out a scene just replace it with their own crap, cut another because they considered it inappropriate, edited Tajirian out of the blue, and voice acting is about the same, so it’s still practically the same dub and some just don’t want to admit it. PUSA is not THAT much different from 4kids to warrant their screw-ups from being excused. I used to see 4kids get bashed when they deserved it, and it’s time to see the same thing happen to PUSA.
Since when did adultery become okay to air on Saturday morning children’s television in the last several years? What I’m saying is that say if 4kids left it in, do you really believe that KidsWB would have aired it? After all how many bans and edits were they apart of? We’re talking about the people who had Fly Me to the Moon changed to The Passionate Pidgey just because of the Columbia disaster and that title would traumatize the children.
Besides that’s not counting the fact that our own domestic television shows get banned, cut, and edited. You think that only happens to anime? You wouldn’t believe the stupidity that goes on in domestic children’s television.
The thing is even when the dubbers get it right, or our own TV shows do the right thing; the networks and parents groups will always be around to ruin it for everybody. And the dubbers use that as an excuse to butcher anime, and our own shows use that as excuse not to deal serious topics. Which leads to utter stupidity all the way around. The shows are stripped of all their value as result, leading children to see nothing more than perfect cookie cutter shows that don’t represent the real world at all.
^ Actually, I don't have any burning desire to see PUSA get trashed for doing the same kind of meaningless edits that 4kids did, because I don't think any of their (tiny) changes have affected the quality of the show at all. The only exceptions are the music (not a disaster; the replacement music isn't bad) and, in PUSA's case, most of the voices (which has a big effect on the quality, but I don't want to bother with spoiler cuts so I'll stop here).
If they didn't lengthen Jessie's skirt except for a couple of occasions, I doubt they'd have gone to the trouble of lengthening Dawn's.
I'm sorry, I'll be stupid instead.
Mm, I suppose it's too simple to only accuse them of stuff they've actually done... let's imagine stuff that they might have done if they'd had the opportunity, and accuse them of that too.
If they didn't lengthen Jessie's skirt except for a couple of occasions, I doubt they'd have gone to the trouble of lengthening Dawn's.
Be that as it may, the idea that 4kids would have terrorised the Japanese into drawing Hikari with a longer skirt is... REALLY stupid. Dawn doesn't actually show anything.
I did no such thing. I think you're paranoid.
The Big Al
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They didn't need to terrorize them. All they needed to do was wave the almighty dollar (or yen) in front of them and make suggestions.
Sorry I misunderstood you, I just get tired of hearing the new dub is so much better when it's not. I do actually like and watch the Dub. I have a lot easier access to it anyway.
^ No biggie. I agree the new dub isn't noticably better on the edit front (and far, far worse on the acting front).
Female characters showing some leg is hardly uncommon in American cartoons, so why is everyone convinced that 4kids would have been scandalised by Dawn's skirt, especially when the game protagonist wanders around dressed like that without comment?
But Jessie's skirt is still miniscule, and has been ever since the start - and she shows midriff, so her outfit ought to cause greater concern. TR have been through two motto changes; it would have been all too easy for Jessie and James to undergo minor outfit changes at the same time, especially since Ash and Brock got a new wardrobe at the start of AG and DP.
Female characters showing some leg is hardly uncommon in American cartoons, so why is everyone convinced that 4kids would have been scandalised by Dawn's skirt, especially when the game protagonist wanders around dressed like that without comment?
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Yes! I completely agree with you, Jo-Jo and Yoshi-kun!
Thank you so much!
I'm glad that some people in this fandom will actually go to great lengths to defend 4Kids. Congrats for doing that!! ^_^
Man, I can't believe people are bashing the 4Kids dub like this. That's so not fair.
Anyway, what I don't understand is why, all of a sudden, people are assuming that "if the dub was still with 4Kids", that they definitely would've done things like this and created more edits.
The fact is, we don't know what 4Kids would've done if they had a chance to dub episodes like these. They don't even have the show anymore, so how would we know what they would do.
Also, I think it's just ridiculous for people to be bashing 4Kids in the first place. Like Jo-Jo said, the dub under Pokemon USA is pretty much the same, edit wise. There's no reason for people to think that Pokemon USA's dub is perfect, when there are things that they have done wrong. And don't get me started on what I dislike about the Pokemon USA dub. (yes, there are things I dislike about them, but I don't go around hating the whole company just because of...those things)
Of course, similar to what I said about Pokemon USA, I can say the reverse about 4Kids. Yes, edit wise, I'm sure 4Kids has done some awful things that part of the fandom dislikes. But, there is no reason for people to completely bash 4Kids, because whether people like to admit this or not, 4Kids did do some things right with the dub.
I mean, look at me. I highly prefer the 4Kids dub. But you don't see me complaining about edits 4Kids has made in seasons 1 through 8.
And at the same time, you also don't see me complaining about edits that Pokemon USA is making.
My point is, the fact that dubbing companies make these kinds of edits (or any edits) doesn't take away my enjoyment of the Pokemon dub. So I have no reason to complain about that stuff. And generally speaking, I think that when people watch the Pokemon dub (or any dub for that matter), one thing they shouldn't worry about is the presence or absence of edits. Because for example, let's say that if people hadn't seen the Japanese version of an episode and didn't already know about these things beforehand, then perhaps people would see the Pokemon dub in an entirley different way. Like they say, ignorance is bliss. And that makes sense, especially when you're talking about edits being made to the dub. ^^
The music thing isn't a big deal to me either, since 4Kids kept enough of the Japanese music to make me happy. And Pokemon USA is pretty much following in 4Kids steps, as far as the music goes. So I'm happy with the music. Well, with the exception of Pokemon USA adding their own music (I prefer the 4Kids BGM over Pokemon USA's - but I don't mind Pokemon USA's music that much, so it's okay).
Nope. Instead, my enjoyment of the dub is being ruined by that other thing Pokemon USA did (which I won't get into for obvious reasons). So yeah, I can still enjoy the dub under Pokemon USA. Just not as much as I did when it was with 4Kids. ^^;
And with that being said, let's try to get this thread back on topic now.
I think Ash is cute as a maid. And also, this is the first time I thought he actually looked "cute" while crossdressing. ^^
But anyway, in general, I don't like it when Ash crossdresses, mainly because he doesn't like it himself. He's always forced to do it and he really hates doing things like that.
Aww....
But we could have a lot of fun discussing hero-Ash, and sacrificial-Ash, and all the other great aspects of his personality. ^_^
All I'm saying is, Ralli, you're free to post in the Ash club if you want. However, if you don't feel comfortable posting there for whatever reason, then that's fine too.
Thank you so much!
I'm glad that some people in this fandom will actually go to great lengths to defend 4Kids. Congrats for doing that!! ^_^
Man, I can't believe people are bashing the 4Kids dub like this. That's so not fair.
Anyway, what I don't understand is why, all of a sudden, people are assuming that "if the dub was still with 4Kids", that they definitely would've done things like this and created more edits.
The fact is, we don't know what 4Kids would've done if they had a chance to dub episodes like these. They don't even have the show anymore, so how would we know what they would do.
Also, I think it's just ridiculous for people to be bashing 4Kids in the first place. Like Jo-Jo said, the dub under Pokemon USA is pretty much the same, edit wise. There's no reason for people to think that Pokemon USA's dub is perfect, when there are things that they have done wrong. And don't get me started on what I dislike about the Pokemon USA dub. (yes, there are things I dislike about them, but I don't go around hating the whole company just because of...those things)
Of course, similar to what I said about Pokemon USA, I can say the reverse about 4Kids. Yes, edit wise, I'm sure 4Kids has done some awful things that part of the fandom dislikes. But, there is no reason for people to completely bash 4Kids, because whether people like to admit this or not, 4Kids did do some things right with the dub.
I mean, look at me. I highly prefer the 4Kids dub. But you don't see me complaining about edits 4Kids has made in seasons 1 through 8.
And at the same time, you also don't see me complaining about edits that Pokemon USA is making.
My point is, the fact that dubbing companies make these kinds of edits (or any edits) doesn't take away my enjoyment of the Pokemon dub. So I have no reason to complain about that stuff. And generally speaking, I think that when people watch the Pokemon dub (or any dub for that matter), one thing they shouldn't worry about is the presence or absence of edits. Because for example, let's say that if people hadn't seen the Japanese version of an episode and didn't already know about these things beforehand, then perhaps people would see the Pokemon dub in an entirley different way. Like they say, ignorance is bliss. And that makes sense, especially when you're talking about edits being made to the dub. ^^
The music thing isn't a big deal to me either, since 4Kids kept enough of the Japanese music to make me happy. And Pokemon USA is pretty much following in 4Kids steps, as far as the music goes. So I'm happy with the music. Well, with the exception of Pokemon USA adding their own music (I prefer the 4Kids BGM over Pokemon USA's - but I don't mind Pokemon USA's music that much, so it's okay).
Nope. Instead, my enjoyment of the dub is being ruined by that other thing Pokemon USA did (which I won't get into for obvious reasons). So yeah, I can still enjoy the dub under Pokemon USA. Just not as much as I did when it was with 4Kids. ^^;
And with that being said, let's try to get this thread back on topic now.
Yes, those are exactly my thoughts as well.
I think Ash is cute as a maid. And also, this is the first time I thought he actually looked "cute" while crossdressing. ^^
But anyway, in general, I don't like it when Ash crossdresses, mainly because he doesn't like it himself. He's always forced to do it and he really hates doing things like that.
Oh, there is?
Aww....
But we could have a lot of fun discussing hero-Ash, and sacrificial-Ash, and all the other great aspects of his personality. ^_^
All I'm saying is, Ralli, you're free to post in the Ash club if you want. However, if you don't feel comfortable posting there for whatever reason, then that's fine too.
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Paul *maybe*, but not J. J's quite similar to a cross between Rio and the Iron Mask Marauder, two characters dubbed quite well under 4Kids. And they also didn't have a problem with Giovanni pretty much literally crucifying Mewtwo, or Domino threatening to kill the baby pokemon...
I think their only objection to Paul would be his *age* more than his actions. Since, ya know, showing a youthful villian and all.
But you all have to remember something else--when 4Kids stopped dubbing it, that was also the time that WB stopped airing it. And we know WB mandated a *bunch* of edits. That's not to put 4Kids entirely in the clear, since we know they're really mindless sometimes, but they're not mindless *all* the time.
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I agree.
Some (but not all) of those edits were made because of KidsWB. And I think some may have been caused by the FCC, too.
Anyway, I think this episode about Miltank and the Maid Cafe is gonna be really good! I can't wait to find out more about it!
Some (but not all) of those edits were made because of KidsWB. And I think some may have been caused by the FCC, too.
Anyway, I think this episode about Miltank and the Maid Cafe is gonna be really good! I can't wait to find out more about it!
Except even a normal person can look at thisMm, I suppose it's too simple to only accuse them of stuff they've actually done... let's imagine stuff that they might have done if they'd had the opportunity, and accuse them of that too.
If they didn't lengthen Jessie's skirt except for a couple of occasions, I doubt they'd have gone to the trouble of lengthening Dawn's.
And say "Isn't that a bit too short?" Do you REALLY believe 4Kids would've been totally ok with it? I mean, look at the very reason they had a fit over Musashi's skirt. The skirt was so short it was heading into "dangerous territory". Yes we don't actually see anything in any of these shots, but that doesn't matter. We don't see anything in the Musashi one either, but that didn't stop them from having fits.
Here's another case where they thought it was too short. Does that look too short to you? Not to me, but apparently 4kids thought so.
Seriously, this is NOT a case of "It's 4Kids, lets bash them!" You were just talking about being paranoid a moment ago? What about the people around here? Anytime someone says something bad about 4Kids anymore, people seem to jump to the conclusion we hate the company with a furious passion. I never said anything like that, did I? No, I just spoke the truth. 4kids has had problems with this sort of thing in the past, to believe they suddenly wouldn't is pretty silly. You just have to use logic.
I mean really, if I said "Hey look, there's a sign. If 4Kids still had the show, it would've been covered up" would you still yell at me? Because I'm assuming something that only makes sense?
If you still believe I'm crazy and being paranoid, whatever. I have no desire to see animated breasts or panties, nor have I ever led anyone to believe that. All I did was point out some facts and then say "I'm pretty sure 4kids would've changed this if they had the show". I don't believe I ever even ONCE said they'd do it as a fact.