Spoilers So...is there anyone who DIDN'T like Zinnia?

[Alolan Coconut]

I wasn't that big of a fan either.
Although I liked the Delta Episode, Zinnia just didn't seem to be the perfect character for the job. Which is pretty unlucky, being an independent character with a vague past and unclear plans, she kinda made me think of an N 2.0.

And I must say this: I understand that you're Draconic and all, but please. That does not mean you have to have a mono-dragon-type team of 5. Especially when 3 out of 5 is 4x weak to ice(!) "Hey, was fun blasting you away with Ice Beam Zinnia."

 

[Ampharos King]

I don't like Zinnia, but I don't hate her character either.

For such an important character, Zinnia didn't leave a strong impression on me. She claimed she was the one who convinced Team Magma (or Aqua) to summon Groudon (or Kyogre), and yet she was absent for the majority of the game. None of the Magma or Aqua top brass mentioned her at all, and it felt like she was tacked on to the game to make it seem like she was more important than she actually was. Besides, I am not a fan of having Maxie's or Archie's progression in their respective games become less significant because somebody else lead them to participate in their missions.

Besides being rather insiginificant in the game lore, Zinnia is also a wild card. With each interaction with her, you ultimately are left with more questions about her past and connections to the people around her than you are provided with answers. Was Zinnia really a Draconid, or was this role assigned to her after the original Aster died? Is she from the alternate dimension that she spoke of during her conversation with Steven and Professor Cozmo? If that is the case, why was destroying Deoxys' meteor so important for her? I really can't back a character whose backstory and intentions are so muddled up.

I respect and admire characters whose intentions are original (for this series), straightforward, and pure of heart. N was a classic example of such a character. N's perception of the world was distorted because he only interacted with Pokémon that were abused by humans. N felt camaraderie for these Pokémon and believed that all Pokémon would be better off if they never had the opportunity to interact with abusive humans. N was an interesting character because he never referred to any of the Pokémon he used as "his," and he only obtained Pokémon merely to challenge the player character's beliefs. N released almost all of the Pokémon he caught soon after. N displayed more conflicted emotions as the story progressed; he felt both surprised and disheartened when he discovered that the player's Pokémon were actually happy interacting with humans. And when the player defeated N the final time, N was willing to take the chance to interact with the Pokémon he currently had.

In B2W2, N's change was further expanded upon when he actually confessed to Ghetsis that he does believe in the power of human and Pokémon interactions:

"And I like Unova. It's the place that taught me how to live as a human... It's the place that made me notice the harmony between Pokémon and humans living together... I will protect the Pokémon and humans who live here!"

Throughout the entire Black and White game, we understood who N was, why he turned out the way he did, and how his interactions with the player (and other characters) has ultimately expanded his worldview. With Zinnia, we got none of that. We barely got any exposition for this character, we never saw Zinnia change or grow as the Delta Episode progressed, and we are left with a bad taste in our mouth knowing that this character could have been better written.

In addition, Zinnia is not at all an original character for this series. Zinnia was determined to sacrifice the lives in the ORAS dimension to protect the lives in that other dimension. Other characters have attempted to perform similar acts in past games. Lysandre was determined to kill off almost all of humanity (san Team Flare and a few others that left a strong impression on him) to restore the world to its "beautiful, natural state." Cyrus wanted to destroy the current Pokémon universe so he can create a new universe that he approved of in its place. The only difference is that Zinnia claimed she did it for somebody else and not for her own good.

Overall, Zinnia felt like a tacked on character to me. The only thing I liked about her was her battle theme.

 

[Silktree]

I feel that a lot of the flaws being brought up are related more to the plot structure than to Zinnia's merit as a character. I think most us can agree that the Delta Episode would have been far more effective as the main plot (which would have turned ORAS into sequels) rather than a post-game episode. Zinnia's presence felt tacked on because it really was - she was absent from the original story which was largely translated into these games. Zinnia aiding Team Magma/Aqua is nothing more than a forced way to connect her to the main plot, so I find it hard to hold it against her.

I like Zinnia for her complexity and the way she speaks her mind. While I appreciated N's philosophy, he ended up not being all that complex and bordered on being one-dimensional. Game Freak had an opportunity to do something new with him in B2W2, but the role they gave him was fairly predictable. He never really confronted Ghetsis or showed a human reaction to what he had put him through, and his "truth" or "ideals" ultimately led nowhere. At the very least, Zinnia has the potential to throw us more surprises, although Game Freak could easily mess that up.

That said, the way she left Whismur behind is inexcusable. I can't imagine that it prefers to stay with her grandmother.

 

[Kallyle]

About Zinnia leaving Aster the Whismur behind, maybe it was never really hers to begin with, but rather her grandmothers. After all, she never used it in battle. It's either that, or Zinnia comes back for it offscreen.

 

[Silktree]

About Zinnia leaving Aster the Whismur behind, maybe it was never really hers to begin with, but rather her grandmothers.

That's possible, but she never told it goodbye. That is no way to treat your "daughter".

 

[Zweilous]

Outrage pretty much explained everything I didn't like about the character. While most of her problems do come from the fact that the game only gives her about an hour to be fleshed out, there's also a number of problems with the character in the general story. She causes a cataclysmic event that endangers many people's lives, she goes around stealing key stones from people who were either friendly or repented (Courtney/Matt being the exception), and is never really called out for it. The story makes her out to be the hero, and yet her actions are pretty abhorrent at times.

Overall, she had potential, but it's just not reached in the Delta Episode, and she really suffered for it.

 

[BlackButterfree]

Maybe we weren't meant to like her... Maybe she was meant to be abrasive and crazy and rude. In real life, there's people you just can't stand no matter how well intentioned they are. And recently, Game Freak has really been getting "real world" with us. Aside from the magical space monsters.

 

[Zweilous]

Considering that they make her out to be the "hero" in this scenario and give her some sympathetic points, I kind of doubt it. I think that the intent was for her to be liked and that she just was a bit rough in doing it.

 

[Team Gaara]

We do have to remember that, as we all pretty much touched on, it's very clear Zinnia is not mentally stable. Not that this should be an excuse, but maybe it better explains some of her actions and the lack of any real remorse from her because of it. Perhaps she doesn't actually realize the damage she's caused. In her mind, she may not fully think she's stealing the Keystones since she thinks the end result is for a good cause. And it may also explain why she didn't see to really care about helping awaken Primal Kyogre and Primal Groudon, despite knowing full well of the destruction they'd bring.

 

[Paleo]

GF decided to give Zinnia a distinct personality, which strongly includes her "the end justifies the means" way of looking at the situation in which we meet her. She has a plan in her head and she will bring it to a good end at any cost, meaning that she gathers Key Stones from anyone, no matter if they're good guys or not.

That may cause people not to like her.

I, however, am quite very charmed by her despite the ruthless and slightly hostile attitude she has throughout most of the Delta Episode.
[sub]I ship her with myself :3[/sub]

 

[CynthiaLover]

I'm neutral toward Zinnia. I neither like her nor hate her. Design wise, however, she's one of GF's best designed characters. However, that's a superficial thing, so let's move on.

I feel Zinnia is a mixed bag. While I haven't done the Delta Episode yet (having too much fun hunting down mirage spots right now, plus busy RL), I've observed plenty of comments and spoilers about her. She's obviously mentally unstable which, while not a real excuse for her behavior, means that she thinks irrationally and doesn't acknowledge (or, maybe more accurately, realize) what her actions can do. She has a sense of self-justification, meaning that, as others have said, she feels that "the ends justify the means", but she gets so wrapped up in the "ends" that the "means" get lost or twisted in the process. She does seem to have a feeling of a "I'm destined to save everyone" mindset, so she feels that no matter what she has to do to achieve her "goal", as long as she achieves it, nothing else matters.

That's still no excuse for her behavior, attitude, and actions, as it makes her nearly as dangerous as other previous apocalyptic-inducing villains (Cyrus is probably the biggest example, as nuking the entire universe is far worse than just nuking a planet). While she is classified as an anti-hero, that doesn't justify what she's done. So when she learns that she's not the "chosen one", it's probably a huge slap in the face to her, hence why she pretty much goes berserk on the player for "robbing" her of her "destiny" (that pre-battle expression would scare the hell out of anyone). She may be well versed in Hoenn's legends, as per her upbringing, but that doesn't mean that one disaster can cancel out another one. Simply put, she nearly caused two apocalypses in one game due to (in her mind) self-justified actions.

While I can't outright hate her, as her mind has clearly been seriously destabilized due to tragedy, I can't love her, either. GF also left a lot about her background to the imagination, so that makes it harder to fully comment on what she really stands for or who she really is (plus, as I stated before, I haven't played the Delta Episode yet, so I can't give a "complete" analysis on her). So my opinion of her is neutral. I don't love her, I don't hate her, she's somewhere in between. Her intentions were probably (keyword: probably) in the right place, she went about it in all the wrong ways. That's my two cents on her.

 

[AndyPKMN]

Personally, I liked her, although I understand why other people didn't. I liked her aggressive attitude, the perky attitude she masked her insecurities behind, her somewhat unhinged nature, and ESPECIALLY her tragic backstory. I do agree that she had a lot of issues that weren't addressed fully by the end of the Delta Episode, but then again, so did N at the end of Black and White, and I kind of hope that like N in Black 2 and White 2, she'll get further character development in a future game (her name makes me think she might conceivably have some role in Pokémon Z, if that ends up being a thing).

 

[BlackButterfree]

Personally, I liked her, although I understand why other people didn't. I liked her aggressive attitude, the perky attitude she masked her insecurities behind, her somewhat unhinged nature, and ESPECIALLY her tragic backstory. I do agree that she had a lot of issues that weren't addressed fully by the end of the Delta Episode, but then again, so did N at the end of Black and White, and I kind of hope that like N in Black 2 and White 2, she'll get further character development in a future game (her name makes me think she might conceivably have some role in Pokémon Z, if that ends up being a thing).

In Pokémon Z, she'd at least be 5 years older (but probably closer to 10) so I hope she gets a redesign if we do get Z version. If she's just the same, un-aging character from a decade ago (when she's already referred to as a grown woman), I'll probably slap someone.

And does anyone else suspect that Aster is not dead, but rather missing? We don't know Emma's family. And she and Zinnia have similar skin tone (something really inconsequential, but who knows?), they're both post-game exclusive, and both walk around with a small Pokémon they don't use in battle. Maybe Emma was never abandoned, but was lost and had amnesia (something that could be alluded to through Looker, who's basically Emma's new dad) and if Hoenn and Kalos are separated by a decade, Emma would be 6 years old by the time of OR/AS, and since Zinnia is again a grown woman, maybe Emma is her daughter. Or her little sister.

 

[The Outrage]

This image is so full of crap. Both Steven and Zinnia are guilty of being willing to sacrifice lives to save others--the only difference is that one of them knew what they were doing.

I'm pretty sure I would have liked Zinnia better as a villain rather than an anti-hero. Hopefully Game Freak makes her a villain in some ORAS/XY follow-up gain where she tries to reunite with Aster by ripping a hole between dimensions, compromising both realities.

Was Zinnia really a Draconid, or was this role assigned to her after the original Aster died? Is she from the alternate dimension that she spoke of during her conversation with Steven and Professor Cozmo?

What do you mean was she really a Draconid? I'm fairly certain that Draconid (and Sootopolitan) are the equivalent of indigenous ethnic groups in Hoenn. What's up for grabs is whether she was the original Lorekeeper or not.

I feel that a lot of the flaws being brought up are releated more to the plot structure than to Zinnia's merit as a character.

Even if we ignore Aqua/Magma, she literally could have just told everyone her intentions, and I'm sure Steven would have let her move forward with her plan. And I don't know, should we really overlook poor characterization because of plot structure? We'd have to forgive Sycamore for....being Sycamore since it seems like Game Freak dropped the Mega Evolution plot from XY to let it be developed in ORAS.

Though I am all for AZ getting a wake-up call since he really didn't deserve the ending he got. He walks the Earth for 3000 years and is a witness to major disasters that are equal in magnitude to the one he brought upon Kalos, and all he thinks about is how sad it is to be immortal.

 

[Almonds]

This image is so full of crap. Both Steven and Zinnia are guilty of being willing to sacrifice lives to save others--the only difference is that one of them knew what they were doing.

Lol that pic from tumblr.

However, just because she's an interesting character doesn't mean that she's not going to crack. Seeing as how she goes to great lengths steal the Keystones, mess up Devon's plans because they're using AZ's spare parts to harvest Infinity Energy, and the way she talks about the war in general makes me think that Aster's death had something to do with the whole ultimate weapon thing AZ created. Maybe an accident with Devon's equipment ended up taking the life of Zinnia's friend, and she blames both the Devon Corporation and AZ himself for this technology's existence taking away her best friend.

If this is the route Game Freak is going, then maybe what Masuda meant by "tying things up in interesting ways" meant that Zinnia's going to be the antagonist of Episode Z, using Volcanion to awaken Zygarde in order to take way Enternal Floette's immortality, and even her life, jsut to punish AZ even more than he has been already. Basically, I think she'll want AZ to suffer just like she did when Aster died, and maybe she'll have Zygarde keep him alive just to torture him for an eternity. Of course, we'll stop her in the end.

If that happens, I'm not sure if Zinnia will even be viewed as a well-made villain. Being a villain just for revenge won't really work well because punishing AZ isn't going to be an effective plot.

1. He lived for 3000 years. He's seen and experienced more tragedies than any other human alive. Same goes for Floette.
2. Making him and Floette immortal for eternity? They've been immortal for 3000 years. It's not going to make a difference if they live more than that.
3. Granting them death? That's probably exactly what they want.
4. Killing Floette and making AZ immortal for eternity? To punish AZ? What if Floette actually wanted death and AZ becomes relieved of some of his guilt since Floette can finally rest in peace, after 3000 years? Would that be punishment?

 

[Silktree]

Even if we ignore Aqua/Magma, she literally could have just told everyone her intentions, and I'm sure Steven would have let her move forward with her plan.

She disliked Steven for what I find to be an acceptable reason. I assume that Zinnia knew that Rayquaza would stop the Primal Reversions (if they actually clashed) and that lives wouldn't necessarily be lost (as risky as that was), but what did Steven tell himself about the use of Infinity Energy? It had been done for years.

Besides:

Calm down there, Prof. It'll be OK. I... We... We can protect this world...and the other.

Now we can do it: The summoning. We will summon Rayquaza! Well then, looks like my job here is done. So don't mind me while I excuse myself. Oh. <player>? I really hope you'll come chasing after me, you know? We'll be heading to that ancient tower, sealed since primal times, the Sky Pillar. If you don't know what that is, well, ask that former Champ of yours. He'll know what I'm talking about. See you there!

She wasn't actually trying to keep people out of the loop. She just has poor communication skills, which isn't a reason to dislike her in my eyes.

 

[The Outrage]

She disliked Steven for what I find to be an acceptable reason. I assume that Zinnia knew that Rayquaza would stop the Primal Reversions (if they actually clashed) and that lives wouldn't necessarily be lost (as risky as that was), but what did Steven tell himself about the use of Infinity Energy? It had been done for years.

It seemed somewhat hypocritical. And the first time around, it took Rayquaza 20 days to come and save the Hoenn region. I guess she gets credit for only trying to wake up one of the Primals so the damage is minimized, but from her dialogue with the PC, it was clear that the destruction needed to last longer.

She wasn't actually trying to keep people out of the loop. She just has poor communication skills, which isn't a reason to dislike her in my eyes.

I will concede the poor communication skills part--after all, it seems like most of her life was being trained for that moment. Kind of indoctrinated like N.

A cross between N and AZ, but still having a chance for better character development. I sure how these loose ends aren't like the ones in BW where Game Freak didn't originally intend to tie them, and hopefully the negative reception of Zinnia doesn't keep her character from appearing again.

4. Killing Floette and making AZ immortal for eternity? To punish AZ? What if Floette actually wanted death and AZ becomes relieved of some of his guilt since Floette can finally rest in peace, after 3000 years? Would that be punishment?

It would be character development, since AZ will actually acknowledge how much he screwed up. The closest we got was a random NPC mourning at Mt. Pyre, talking about how even if he could bring his Pokemon back and make it live forever, he wouldn't, because that's not what it would want.

Right now, all we have for AZ is him crying about how lonely it is without Floette....and then he gets Floette. He did nothing to deserve that redemption. Though, it would be more interesting for Zinnia to be the antagonist by nearly destroying the multiverse (because let's face it, Cyrus already went for the universe) to reunite with Aster. It may have been her duty to save Hoenn from the meteoroid, but it seemed more like she was interested in making sure the other Aster was still alive.

Of course, I do think there should be a confrontation with AZ. Why would she believe that the other Aster is still alive, if it wasn't related to the Ultimate Weapon? That's what drives the changes between both universes, so for Aster to be alive in the other one, Zinnia's Aster would have died due to something AZ-related.

 

[BlackButterfree]

It seemed somewhat hypocritical. And the first time around, it took Rayquaza 20 days to come and save the Hoenn region. I guess she gets credit for only trying to wake up one of the Primals so the damage is minimized, but from her dialogue with the PC, it was clear that the destruction needed to last longer.

She wasn't actually trying to keep people out of the loop. She just has poor communication skills, which isn't a reason to dislike her in my eyes.

I will concede the poor communication skills part--after all, it seems like most of her life was being trained for that moment. Kind of indoctrinated like N.

A cross between N and AZ, but still having a chance for better character development. I sure how these loose ends aren't like the ones in BW where Game Freak didn't originally intend to tie them, and hopefully the negative reception of Zinnia doesn't keep her character from appearing again.

4. Killing Floette and making AZ immortal for eternity? To punish AZ? What if Floette actually wanted death and AZ becomes relieved of some of his guilt since Floette can finally rest in peace, after 3000 years? Would that be punishment?

It would be character development, since AZ will actually acknowledge how much he screwed up. The closest we got was a random NPC mourning at Mt. Pyre, talking about how even if he could bring his Pokemon back and make it live forever, he wouldn't, because that's not what it would want.

Right now, all we have for AZ is him crying about how lonely it is without Floette....and then he gets Floette. He did nothing to deserve that redemption. Though, it would be more interesting for Zinnia to be the antagonist by nearly destroying the multiverse (because let's face it, Cyrus already went for the universe) to reunite with Aster. It may have been her duty to save Hoenn from the meteoroid, but it seemed more like she was interested in making sure the other Aster was still alive.

Of course, I do think there should be a confrontation with AZ. Why would she believe that the other Aster is still alive, if it wasn't related to the Ultimate Weapon? That's what drives the changes between both universes, so for Aster to be alive in the other one, Zinnia's Aster would have died due to something AZ-related.

AZ seemed to be truly remorseful in XY for what he did to Kalos, if only for the sole reason that it cost him Floette. But remorse is remorse, regardless of the source behind it. I don't know, I feel like just because we didn't see AZ's character development doesn't mean it's not there. The guy's been alive for 3,000 years. He probably thinks it's futile to communicate with people because then he forms bonds. Bonds which are broken like 100 years later when everyone he knows is dead.

 

[Silktree]

Of course, I do think there should be a confrontation with AZ. Why would she believe that the other Aster is still alive, if it wasn't related to the Ultimate Weapon? That's what drives the changes between both universes, so for Aster to be alive in the other one, Zinnia's Aster would have died due to something AZ-related.

Aster got killed as a result of Infinity Energy?

 

[The Outrage]

Aster got killed as a result of Infinity Energy?

I wouldn't say Infinity Energy specifically, but by something that changed in their universe as a result of Infinity Energy. There would be no reason for Zinnia to assume that Aster is alive in the other universe if her death wasn't related to how both universes divided. Of course, Game Freak could just not touch on it and have her alive.