Generation 8 Rumours/Fakes/Leaks

[WallflowerCanyon]

Wow so reading the Pokemon Plus and Minus rumor over again (the thread I found was from 2014 so wow!) It's actually kind of intriguing. The rumor also mentions a Nintendo system that matches up perfectly with what the Switch is calling said system a "Fusion project" in which there is a handheld mode and what is a essentially a docked mode (they call a terminal mode) for the tv. On top of that the rumor also states that the battle system is entirely reworked just like our more recent rumors suggest and even says the theme is Traditions vs Exploration (or innovation if you will). It's incredibly interesting to see a rumor from 3 or more years ago directly referencing things that we are talking about today and even referencing something that actually happened in the form of the Switch. We didn't even have the code name for the Switch at that point I don't think! Maybe we really will get a game that is like the Plus and Minus rumor after all? Some interesting things to mention is that it states that the docked mode and the handheld mode have different capabilities for areas that you can access. As well as making Pokemon Bank an actual location within the game.The Bank part actually makes a TON of sense. I'm not sure I see at this point them porting over the actual bank app. If it's integrated into the game that makes way more sense. Especially given how the Switch doesn't yet have a decent way to organize apps and game locations on the main screen. It'd just be more clutter. I honestly don't care where the next set of games take place. If it's a Kanto return then that could be really cool to see, BUT if it's anything like the Plus/Minus rumor then we may have a very VERY interesting game on our hands. Also if the game was really in some sort of development THAT early on then I think we can assume that 2018 isn't totally out of the question for release. That said they could still be holding onto it for 2019 if that's when they planned on it coming out anyway. All very interesting stuff tho. Here's the thread I found that outlines the entire rumor. It's an interesting read at the very least. Re-analyzing the "Pokemon Plus & Pokemon Minus" RUMOR. - Nintendo 3DS Message Board for 3DS - GameFAQs

That is really interesting. The only thing that I'm really skeptical about is the plot... a person can argue they went dark in XY in terms of death, but the thing about religious zealots and human sacrifices is something that I don't think would go over very well for a lot of people and cause backlash that Game Freak wouldn't want. If it had stuff like that, I personally wouldn't buy it myself.

 

[Foxwarrior]

I think plus minus has solid ideas, and they can make the story kid friendly letting the darker aspects subtle, in which adults can grasp it easier, as they always do. But "a lion and a ghost with hurricane like appendices" legendaries are too similar to Lunala and Solgaleo, so if true, probably this early concept was implemented in sun moon, even a shii lion looking different.

 

[TheMonster6893]

I'd say the plot is probably described in a darker way in the rumor than it would be shown off in the game. They would steer clear of certain key words like death and mortality. They probably just say sacrifice and nothing much more. In any event one of the potential rumors in no direct relation to this did say the story would be darker. The person even said they weren't sure how the plot would make the E rating. I'm sure it'll still be Rated E, but the fact that they said that makes me suspicious. Could we really have a rumor from 3 or more years come true? It's so crazy to think that hahaha

I think plus minus has solid ideas, and they can make the story kid friendly letting the darker aspects subtle, in which adults can grasp it easier, as they always do. But "a lion and a ghost with hurricane like appendices" legendaries are too similar to Lunala and Solgaleo, so if true, probably this early concept was implemented in sun moon, even a shii lion looking different.

Yeah that's my one problem with it. Doesn't seem likely they'd use the same kind of legendary Pokemon twice in a row. I'd say of this does turn out to be anything at all then the legends will end up being different.

 

[Defiant]

There are ways of making things subtle and vague enough to still make the E rating.

There are still some people to this day who think the original Giovanni didn't commit suicide and the splash heard in the celebi event is static or something.

 

[Minnale101]

There are ways of making things subtle and vague enough to still make the E rating.

There are still some people to this day who think the original Giovanni didn't commit suicide and the splash heard in the celebi event is static or something.

lysande fell to his death in x and y

 

[Defiant]

Plus Gary's Raticate and Lookers Croagunk. The old lady at My Pyre... The Pokemon games are no stranger to characters and pokemon dying.

Horrific Gene splicing isn't what most would consider kid friendly either.

 

[Cookies and Creme]

Plus Gary's Raticate and Lookers Croagunk. The old lady at My Pyre... The Pokemon games are no stranger to characters and pokemon dying.

Horrific Gene splicing isn't what most would consider kid friendly either.

Gary's Raticate didn't die. There is no evidence that it died. As much as I dislike MatPat, Game Theory and other channels did debunk this theory

 

[TheMonster6893]

Regardless of whether Blue/Gary's Raticate died or not *cough*it did*cough* it's obvious that a slightly darker theme for the series isn't totally out of the question. They're not shy of dipping into the darkness and there are ways of being a little more serious and dark without it needing to suddenly turn into a mature rating. The Plus and Minus rumor is just such an interesting piece of work. If it's real then we have a leak that's been year in the making and that's astounding! If it's not then we have a fake rumor that basically guess very accurately that the next Nintendo system would be a hybrid unit that has a handheld mode as well as a docked mode. And that's well before we even started getting NX rumors too I might remind people. It's interesting one way or the other and who ever initially wrote it up deserves an award hahaha I will say that if you track the rumor back to where it apparently started, the site that got the initial rumor apparently vouches for the source saying that they have provided info prior to it and they see no reason to doubt it. Granted this was all 3 years ago(almost 4 since it was in January of 2014) but the fact of the matter is that it's all very suspicious.

 

[Rosalia R]

Wow so reading the Pokemon Plus and Minus rumor over again (the thread I found was from 2014 so wow!) It's actually kind of intriguing. The rumor also mentions a Nintendo system that matches up perfectly with what the Switch is calling said system a "Fusion project" in which there is a handheld mode and what is a essentially a docked mode (they call a terminal mode) for the tv. On top of that the rumor also states that the battle system is entirely reworked just like our more recent rumors suggest and even says the theme is Traditions vs Exploration (or innovation if you will). It's incredibly interesting to see a rumor from 3 or more years ago directly referencing things that we are talking about today and even referencing something that actually happened in the form of the Switch. We didn't even have the code name for the Switch at that point I don't think! Maybe we really will get a game that is like the Plus and Minus rumor after all? Some interesting things to mention is that it states that the docked mode and the handheld mode have different capabilities for areas that you can access. As well as making Pokemon Bank an actual location within the game.The Bank part actually makes a TON of sense. I'm not sure I see at this point them porting over the actual bank app. If it's integrated into the game that makes way more sense. Especially given how the Switch doesn't yet have a decent way to organize apps and game locations on the main screen. It'd just be more clutter. I honestly don't care where the next set of games take place. If it's a Kanto return then that could be really cool to see, BUT if it's anything like the Plus/Minus rumor then we may have a very VERY interesting game on our hands. Also if the game was really in some sort of development THAT early on then I think we can assume that 2018 isn't totally out of the question for release. That said they could still be holding onto it for 2019 if that's when they planned on it coming out anyway. All very interesting stuff tho. Here's the thread I found that outlines the entire rumor. It's an interesting read at the very least. Re-analyzing the "Pokemon Plus & Pokemon Minus" RUMOR. - Nintendo 3DS Message Board for 3DS - GameFAQs

I'm super conflicted about this. My initial reaction was disbelief, since I dismissed that leak as fake a really long time ago, but upon closer examination it's surprisingly plausible. A minor point for its credibility that I don't think anyone has mentioned yet is Yungoos - the IRL mongoose species Yungoos was based off of was in fact native to South East Asia.

Also, the "New Pokemon Type similar to Shinies, no details yet on how they work but I’ve been told they 'change the game significantly' " sounds like it could potentially be referring to regional variants.

However, there's also some things that don't line up that well in my opinion - I don't think any of them flat-out kill the chance of this leak being real, but I suspect some of these may have been either made up, misinterpreted by the source, or scrapped from the final version.

First, as other people have mentioned the legendaries sound way too similar to Solgaleo and Lunala, both in typing and in theme. Of course, since the development period for these games likely overlapped with that of Sun and Moon, it's possible that these legendaries got turned into Solgaleo and Lunala and "Plus and Minus" will have two completely new legendaries.

Second, the gym ideas seem a little like the fanservice so many fake leaks incorporate, as a lot of people have voiced their desire for gyms with a theme other than one specific type. I also highly doubt there will be a Gym that requires Sky Battles, as that would (assuming unchanged mechanics) would require you to catch a flying or levitating Pokemon or two and train them up to a reasonable level to beat the Gym. And even then that's disregarding how GameFreak hasn't acknowledged Sky Battles since XY.

Overall, I'm very split on the leak. The evidence it has going for it is pretty strong, and while there are inconsistencies, most of them could be explained as features that were scrapped early on. I have no doubt that they could pull off the described story or an only slightly toned down version of it and get away with an E rating, given the stuff they've gotten away with in the past (Lysandre's fate, Lusamine and Ghetsis's treatment of Lille, Gladion, and N, Lusamine's room of frozen Pokemon, etc.). I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this one.

 

[RileyXY1]

I'm thinking that Plus and Minus is fake. They would never have religious zealots and human sacrifice in a Pokemon game. It would be too dark and controversial for their child audience. Also, they would never force the player to do Sky Battles, given how all Sky Battles in X&Y were optional and they haven't used the feature since.

 

[TheMonster6893]

As far as the gym battles go I would say that's another part that may be changed. Remember that even if this is real, the rumor was 3 years ago. It was just after XY came out and those concepts and mechanics were still fresh in their minds as well as everyone else's. It's entirely possible that they had intended Sky battles to be way more of a mainstay than it ended up being. Especially after ORAS essentially had them too when we were soaring. They prolly figured that while it's a cool mechanic it's also not very viable unless you allow more than just flying or levitating Pokemon in it. If this is real then parts of it may have been scrapped and other parts may have been reworked into new things

 

[VelVoxelRaptor]

I'm thinking that Plus and Minus is fake. They would never have religious zealots and human sacrifice in a Pokemon game. It would be too dark and controversial for their child audience. Also, they would never force the player to do Sky Battles, given how all Sky Battles in X&Y were optional and they haven't used the feature since.

I mean... 20 Surprisingly Dark Pokedex Entries From Pokemon Sun and Moon

And also... https://www.google.ca/amp/s/kotaku....okedex-entries-get-pretty-dark-1788760230/amp

Not to forget literal Drifloon kid napping
https://www.google.ca/amp/s/kotaku....story-in-ultra-pokemon-sun-and-1820644342/amp

 

[Rosalia R]

I'm thinking that Plus and Minus is fake. They would never have religious zealots and human sacrifice in a Pokemon game. It would be too dark and controversial for their child audience. Also, they would never force the player to do Sky Battles, given how all Sky Battles in X&Y were optional and they haven't used the feature since.

I mean, Lysandre attempted mass genocide in XY, but they didn't use that word and the game got away with an E rating just fine. I suspect the leak may be slightly exaggerating how dark the story is, and it's almost certainly using words that the actual games never would, like "religious zealots." The human sacrifice thing probably wouldn't be violently slicing your friend's guts up or anything like that, but rather some magical, non-bloody sort of sacrifice that would lessen the effect for kids, a bit like how the Mystery Dungeon games

Spoiler: PMD spoilers

have the protagonist disappear into a golden light instead of straight up die.

And that's assuming the sacrifice happens at all, which it very well may not given the potential reluctance of GameFreak to kill non-evil human major characters. And even if they do die, in a game like Pokemon nothing is stopping them from coming back.

Fully agree on the Sky Battles part though, requiring that would be stupid.

 

[TheMonster6893]

Pokemon can go dark without outright showing death up close and personal. I imagine the scene would play out with the evil team prepping the sacrifice ritual and then the player storms their base and save s the day. They don't need to show the kid being disemboweled in order to get the story point across. Dark stuff happens in Pokemon all the time. most of the time it's just inferred rather than out right showing it.

 

[VelVoxelRaptor]

My only question is, if this leak is real, how did it get out so early? Was it there original plans for Sun/Moon they decided to shelve? How would this even happen? It would be a leak 3 generations early. Also the + And - buttons are only on Nintendo Consoles (Not handheld I believe) so “Pokemon Plus And Minus” could work (Someone said this a long time ago)

 

[Bolt Strike]

I remember the Plus and Minus rumor, it sounded like something I wanted at the time, but I wasn't sure if it was possible. I think they just got lucky. A lot of people were hoping for a hybrid console after 3DS and Wii U, so that's somewhat of an easy guess to make. They also talk about the game having an MMO mode, another common fan wish that Game Freak has denied for a while. Plus the way they describe it doesn't quite match up with the Switch, they mention a "terminal unit" as if it were closer to a traditional console with processors inside the unit, but the Switch just has a dock and all of the gruntwork is in the handheld unit. Ultimately I think the Plus and Minus rumor is just a fanboy wishlist and not legitimate insider information, I wouldn't put any weight into that one.

 

[TheMonster6893]

I guess it's the kind of thing where early stages were being put together and since they thought it'd be very far off for release nobody really noticed info getting out? That is if it's even real. Again like everyone else back in 2014 I would have scoffed at this and said no way. Now that we know what we know and have other rumor sources talking about some very similar stuff it's very suspicious. I'd say that at this point this rumor has a reasonable chance at being real. Whether all of what's in it ends up being in a game, that's up in the air. I imagine much of it is prototype ideas and mechanics that may or may not make it into a final game. Like the Sky battles may not come back now that GF seems to have given up on it for instance.

I remember the Plus and Minus rumor, it sounded like something I wanted at the time, but I wasn't sure if it was possible. I think they just got lucky. A lot of people were hoping for a hybrid console after 3DS and Wii U, so that's somewhat of an easy guess to make. They also talk about the game having an MMO mode, another common fan wish that Game Freak has denied for a while. Plus the way they describe it doesn't quite match up with the Switch, they mention a "terminal unit" as if it were closer to a traditional console with processors inside the unit, but the Switch just has a dock and all of the gruntwork is in the handheld unit. Ultimately I think the Plus and Minus rumor is just a fanboy wishlist and not legitimate insider information, I wouldn't put any weight into that one.

To be fair that was 3 years ago. Using the term "terminal unit" is generic enough it could mean anything, but it does hint to the Switch's docked mode. Back then the final designs on the Switch were likely not even drawn up with yet entirely. Nintendo prolly had an idea for a concept and specs for it, but I don't think they knew that it would look exactly as it does now then. Back 2014 yes people were speculating about Nintendo's next system, but it wasn't until at least 2015 that things really got rolling. Also anything can sound like fanservice if you spin it that way. In 2010 if anyone said that they'd bring back certain gen 1 Pokemon with new forms people would say that it sounds too fanservice-y and wouldn't happen. In SM we got Regional variants in the Alolan forms. Also as far as more MMO style gameplay is concerned to be fair the tech was never really there for Pokemon until now. Until now GF never had a system available that would allow for proper player to player communication that is even similar to MMO style. Sure there's some minor stuff they did with the Entralink, but that's in person stuff and only for a very specific mechanic with very specif rules. Anything can sound like a fanboy wishlist without context. Nothing is truly impossible tho.

 

[Lillie Blossoms]

Pokemon can definitely be dark while retaining the same usual rating IE: many Dex entries, all the Ghost lore, mentioned passings, Lysandres genocide plan and attempt at killing the player with a massive energy beam, explored Moral Beliefs, Ghetsis verbal abuse to N, Team Plasma shown physically abusing a Munna, Hugh physically hitting a Neo Plasma grunt, Kyurem almost killing the trainer (BW2), even the Seven Sages have religious tones to them especially their encounter dialogue in N's Castle. All in all Pokemon is known for dark undertones from within.

 

[Riahi]

Pokemon has always been dark to an extent, just in a subtle way where it doesn't necessarily shows you directly but use implications. That's one of the most fascinating things in the pokemon games

 

[Defiant]

The original games had you fight the mafia who abused animals, even killing someone's mother who's ghost was left to haunt the surrounding populace and then capture a cloned animal who has undergone "horrific Gene splicing"

So someone acting like a religious zealot and trying to sacrifce whatever on a magical alter would actually be significantly toned down from the originals.

Not to mention team flares Nazi-esque, attempt at mass genocide with only the chosen few allowed to survive and a constant hang up on keeping the world pure.