Mafia Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Endgame - Town/Independent Win

[jda95]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

i don't particularly see why Noivern would be relevant? unless he's scum or has an informative role he wouldn't have any new information (and even then he wouldn't be sharing with us) so

 

[Phoenicks]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

It's a reaction vote for pressure.

Do I have to mention someone every time they become relevant?

It's not as though I'm conspiring to lynch a slot with no basis for a lynch whatsoveer.

Mentioning your vote target is common courtesy as it gives them a chance to defend themselves and hopefully, get information in case they forgot to check this thread

I appreciate your concern; it's my vote and I will cast it without a mention. I think they're a bother (especially so shortly after an update that already has one).

 

[GliscorMan]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

Does anyone, by chance, know who Hitomi was targeting? The flavor text makes it sound like she was on to something with her photography ability.

 

[Midorikawa]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

Does anyone, by chance, know who Hitomi was targeting? The flavor text makes it sound like she was on to something with her photography ability.

No outside communications so no.

Anyways VOTE: Phoenicks

I find his reaction to my questioning about an ability to be odd. He tried to get attention off of it immediately when abilities can easily help decide someone's alignment. My role allowed me to discover this ability and I know who the user is, and no I'm not a rolechecker. I will gladly explain my ability after people answer my question I asked at the beginning of the phase. Also notice how Phoenicks went after noivern instead of an inactive. Noivern made himself look scummy D1 and provided mafia with an easy lynch. Phoenicks could be attempting that again.

 

[Phoenicks]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

Does anyone, by chance, know who Hitomi was targeting? The flavor text makes it sound like she was on to something with her photography ability.

No outside communications so no.

Anyways VOTE: Phoenicks

I find his reaction to my questioning about an ability to be odd. He tried to get attention off of it immediately when abilities can easily help decide someone's alignment. My role allowed me to discover this ability and I know who the user is, and no I'm not a rolechecker. I will gladly explain my ability after people answer my question I asked at the beginning of the phase. Also notice how Phoenicks went after noivern instead of an inactive. Noivern made himself look scummy D1 and provided mafia with an easy lynch. Phoenicks could be attempting that again.

1) Where did I try to get attention off it immediately? Should I have waited when my opinion is "this is a bad thing to be doing"?

2) You are helping the mafia because they now have a better idea of your role than town does.

3) Explaining this ability does not make things better. Unless you have information that catches scum working on public discussion will be more effective.

4) What does "went after noivern" mean? I pressure voted him to gain information -- is that bad?

5) Why should I have gone after an inactive? Is that a rule? Or am I bound to only 'go after' inactives because I have expressed that preference before?

6) You think "Noivern made himself look scummy D1;" I did not and said so.

7) It was an "easy lynch" because Mijz froze the votes. Do you think that lynch would have happened naturally?

8) If I was scum looking for an easy lynch, why would I begin with no case on a slot that has no incriminating evidence?

********

9) These are not rherotical questions. I would like answers.

10) Please stop hounding me. I'm trying to have fun playing this game.

 

[Buoy]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

@Mijzelffan; Is it okay if I ask you to post what you think of Midorikawa/Harpy so far?

just so you don't happen to 'forget' to answer anytime soon, or maybe so you can see in case you 'didn't notice' before

 

[Midorikawa]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

1) Where did I try to get attention off it immediately? Should I have waited when my opinion is "this is a bad thing to be doing"?

Why is discussing an ability bad when no one knows who's it is. Did I got out in thread saying "Paperhorse can redirect votes". No I just asked others opinion if an ability seems mafia because it is then yes I will out them, if not then I will let the player be. You said abilities are pointless to discuss and thus tried to redirect players attention and get their attention away from the information I have.

2) You are helping the mafia because they now have a better idea of your role than town does.

How so? They can't use me. As most of the players are town if I use my ability wisely it only helps town not mafia as they can't contact me without revealing themselves. Mafia have the same idea of my role as town.

3) Explaining this ability does not make things better. Unless you have information that catches scum working on public discussion will be more effective.

Considering there are no outside communications public discussion is the only way. If I came out saying someone is a godfather/rolechecker then town would have jumped on them and lynched them. This is the same thing but I'm not outing the person unless town thinks they are scum.

4) What does "went after noivern" mean? I pressure voted him to gain information -- is that bad?

Why him? He's still at the same point as us after getting lynched. There were plenty others yet you chose him.

5) Why should I have gone after an inactive? Is that a rule? Or am I bound to only 'go after' inactives because I have expressed that preference before?

No but the point is you chose a player who just resubbed in over players not dead. A player who got lynched off of being scummy day one when he was town over players who could give better reactions and most likely not super scummy actions in reply.

6) You think "Noivern made himself look scummy D1;" I did not and said so.

You did not after his softclaim. Doesn't mean anything. He was still looking scummy in a lot of players eyes and also you could have started saying that to look more town when he was mislynched.

7) It was an "easy lynch" because Mijz froze the votes. Do you think that lynch would have happened naturally?

Yes.

8) If I was scum looking for an easy lynch, why would I begin with no case on a slot that has no incriminating evidence?

Because all you need is a few scummy reactions to get someone lynched.

10) Please stop hounding me. I'm trying to have fun playing this game.

Stop hounding you? Seriously? I'm attacking you because I think you're scum for now and you are just looking even more scummy right now to me. Getting attacked like this is part of mafias. Are you worried others will start following my lead?

@Buoy; 1)There are 19 players other than Mijz so why question only him, especially at this point after the night phase? 2) Why are you not questioning about other players or is it you are afraid of me becoming the one that reveals you as scum?

 

[Buoy]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Night 1 - The first victim

@Buoy; 1)There are 19 players other than Mijz so why question only him, especially at this point after the night phase? 2) Why are you not questioning about other players or is it you are afraid of me becoming the one that reveals you as scum?

1. I only want to ask that question of Mijz because I personally want his opinion on you. I don't care what Phoenicks or anyone else thinks of you, I asked for Mijz's opinion, and the reasons why don't actually concern you right now -- they concern Mijz, which is why I asked him, and not anybody else.

2. yea!! u got me!! im literally QUAKING in my little socks right now bc im frightened to death of u revealing me to be scum!!! hm, no. i'm asking mijz his opinion on you specifically because there's something i want to see if i'm right about or not. besides, me asking other people for their opinions on you hardly equates to me being worried that you're going to 'reveal me as scum', and i don't really see how you reached that conclusion.

do you really think that you have the potential to worry me that much? sorry to break it to you, but nope.

 

[Phoenicks]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

Now is way too early to be speculating about role-based abilities. Spreading information right now helps the mafia.

Harpy, if you're softclaiming something useful to town, you shouldn't be.

Vote: Noivern

Now that you're a new slot, what do you have to say about the game?

The only things I can say right now is that:

• I'm basically a new player, with no information, even after subbing.
• I'm not resurrected, but substituted in.
• I still have a role in the game.
• The "honour" of getting lynched twice, in the same game, is... something strange, and yet I'm strangely prepared for that, should things go very wrong.

Yes.

But what do you think in response to the thread?

1) Where did I try to get attention off it immediately? Should I have waited when my opinion is "this is a bad thing to be doing"?

Why is discussing an ability bad when no one knows who's it is. Did I got out in thread saying "Paperhorse can redirect votes". No I just asked others opinion if an ability seems mafia because it is then yes I will out them, if not then I will let the player be. You said abilities are pointless to discuss and thus tried to redirect players attention and get their attention away from the information I have.

2) You are helping the mafia because they now have a better idea of your role than town does.

How so? They can't use me. As most of the players are town if I use my ability wisely it only helps town not mafia as they can't contact me without revealing themselves. Mafia have the same idea of my role as town.

3) Explaining this ability does not make things better. Unless you have information that catches scum working on public discussion will be more effective.

Considering there are no outside communications public discussion is the only way. If I came out saying someone is a godfather/rolechecker then town would have jumped on them and lynched them. This is the same thing but I'm not outing the person unless town thinks they are scum.

4) What does "went after noivern" mean? I pressure voted him to gain information -- is that bad?

Why him? He's still at the same point as us after getting lynched. There were plenty others yet you chose him.

5) Why should I have gone after an inactive? Is that a rule? Or am I bound to only 'go after' inactives because I have expressed that preference before?

No but the point is you chose a player who just resubbed in over players not dead. A player who got lynched off of being scummy day one when he was town over players who could give better reactions and most likely not super scummy actions in reply.

6) You think "Noivern made himself look scummy D1;" I did not and said so.

You did not after his softclaim. Doesn't mean anything. He was still looking scummy in a lot of players eyes and also you could have started saying that to look more town when he was mislynched.

7) It was an "easy lynch" because Mijz froze the votes. Do you think that lynch would have happened naturally?

Yes.

8) If I was scum looking for an easy lynch, why would I begin with no case on a slot that has no incriminating evidence?

Because all you need is a few scummy reactions to get someone lynched.

10) Please stop hounding me. I'm trying to have fun playing this game.

Stop hounding you? Seriously? I'm attacking you because I think you're scum for now and you are just looking even more scummy right now to me. Getting attacked like this is part of mafias. Are you worried others will start following my lead?

@Buoy; 1)There are 19 players other than Mijz so why question only him, especially at this point after the night phase? 2) Why are you not questioning about other players or is it you are afraid of me becoming the one that reveals you as scum?

Yikes.

Abilities are not pointless. It is almost pointless to discuss them now. Your information /does/ help the mafia because it gives them a better idea of the game balance.

Mafia have 5-6 players already; they know those roles. Depending on what those roles are they may be informed about more.

Each townie knows his own role only.

Because your information doesn't out scum (the role doesn't sound scummy or towny) it only gives scum useful information.

It's Day 2. We can't shortcut through the actual work of a mafia game.

I'm going to extricate myself from this argument now. It's too prickly.

 

[CrackFox]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

@Noivern; I understand the sentiment but sitting on the bench is not the way to go. Form an opinion.

As far as Mijz goes, I trust him for the time being. I'm getting mixed feelings from Buoy and Phoenicks, particularly @Phoenicks; I don't like the way you voted Noirvern just like that, mention him and threaten to vote but don't just do it. People are busy and can't always make time for defending themself, especially if they don't have any idea that they are being discussed. I wouldn't mention people in all cases but for important posts like voting and direct questions, I would. Makes me think you don't care as long as you are establishing the focus on somebody else. As well as that, I don't like you or Buoy's attitude. It's too aggressive for my liking. Innocent people are usually much cooler about the situation because they aren't experiencing the same kind of pressure.

Vote: Phoenicks

Reason being, I feel like he's trying to get attention off himself by placing rash votes and calling people out for petty reasons. I.E joke votes. This vote is not final, i'm fully open to hearing your defense.

 

[jda95]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

As well as that, I don't like you or Buoy's attitude. It's too aggressive for my liking. Innocent people are usually much cooler about the situation because they aren't experiencing the same kind of pressure.

key word being usually!!!!! it's very naive to expect all players to act the same way, and adopt a "town=calm, scum=rash" mentality because that's just not true. but i'd have to disagree with your judgment that they are being overly aggressive anyway. wasn't buoy responding to someone who actually accused him of being afraid of her because he was asking someone else about her?

 

[CrackFox]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

As well as that, I don't like you or Buoy's attitude. It's too aggressive for my liking. Innocent people are usually much cooler about the situation because they aren't experiencing the same kind of pressure.

key word being usually!!!!! it's very naive to expect all players to act the same way, and adopt a "town=calm, scum=rash" mentality because that's just not true. but i'd have to disagree with your judgment that they are being overly aggressive anyway. wasn't buoy responding to someone who actually accused him of being afraid of her because he was asking someone else about her?

Aren't we all naive? That's kind of the townie prerogative. I'll stick with my vote until I get a reason to change it.

Harpy wanted to know why Buoy was so keen to hear Mijzelffan's opinion of her. It was a fair question since he seems intent on knowing. His response was pretty aggressive which never sits well with me. If you have nothing to hide, just calmly tell the truth or if it's dangerous to state the truth in thread, point that out. No need to go into attack mode. I'll be watching his actions closely, as well as Harpy's.

 

[Buoy]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

As well as that, I don't like you or Buoy's attitude. It's too aggressive for my liking. Innocent people are usually much cooler about the situation because they aren't experiencing the same kind of pressure.

key word being usually!!!!! it's very naive to expect all players to act the same way, and adopt a "town=calm, scum=rash" mentality because that's just not true. but i'd have to disagree with your judgment that they are being overly aggressive anyway. wasn't buoy responding to someone who actually accused him of being afraid of her because he was asking someone else about her?

Aren't we all naive? That's kind of the townie prerogative. I'll stick with my vote until I get a reason to change it.

Harpy wanted to know why Buoy was so keen to hear Mijzelffan's opinion of her. It was a fair question since he seems intent on knowing. His response was pretty aggressive which never sits well with me. If you have nothing to hide, just calmly tell the truth or if it's dangerous to state the truth in thread, point that out. No need to go into attack mode. I'll be watching his actions closely, as well as Harpy's.

yes, i'm absolutely intent on knowing. i think i'll just die if i don't find out! sarcasm aside, generally i would like a response in a reasonable amount of time after asking the question, when i know that person has been around and has probably had time to answer, but doesn't. also, my response was aggressive, but not secretive -- i don't particularly appreciate ridiculous conclusions such as "OMG UR ASKING FOR OPINIONS ON ME BC UR AFRAID OF ME" being jumped to for literally no reason, so i admit that i did get sarcastic with her. additionally, i didn't attack her -- i didn't accuse her of anything at all, and i didn't say i found her suspicious for any reason. i merely replied to her questions -- yes, maybe in an aggressive way, but i still answered appropriately imo.

 

[Froakie]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

There really is no point mentioning somebody everytime you vote, especially if it's just so soon after a phase update. They are guaranteed to see your vote, and you do not have to defend yourself or even react to every single vote on you if there is nothing to defend if you feel like the vote was done for no reason. Mentioning a player is not 'common-courtesy', that practice has become common recently, but never used to be used. You should be expected to read the thread yourself, rather than being tagged every time, which make it seem much more desperate to get a response out of the voted player when usually it's much nicer to let them read it at their own pace and when they would like to, rather than being hounded to reply.

In response to Harpy's role revelation thing, I say that a nexus role could be either way. As the tracker died last night, and the cop died back in day one, having a nexus role as a mafia member would actually be a very powerful role, as they completely hide themselves away from alignment-finding roles. I don't really see a point of a town nexus, as all it could hide them from are doctor protects, cop checks (when they'd turn out innocent anyway), and a mafia rolecop which I guess would be useful. I'd like to say nexus is a mafia role, however I've seen it swing both ways so sorry I can't give a definite answer to that.

 

[CrackFox]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

Tell me does being able to redirect votes off yourself and back at the one who cast them sound like a mafia ability?

It's pretty dubious. Softclaim or not, I don't know. Doesn't sound like Nexus to me though. Might be wrong but kills are usually not included. I'm intrigued to know more. If you are saying that the role redirects the votes back on to the caster, then that would pretty much make the person lynch proof. When you put it like that, it definitely sounds scummy.

 

[GliscorMan]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

I'm with Buoy here. We haven't heard from Mijz yet, so keeping the pressure up is a must. Otherwise, we may not know for sure. Glossing over it is losing a vital chance for discussion regarding the lynch.

The way Harpy is jumping on Phoenicks is enough to say to me that my previous theory is wrong. Harpy and Nick couldn't possibly be on a maf team. That kind of tension can't really be faked.

Aside from that, to what they actually said. There's something really wrong about what Mido posted. There's nothing much that's really solid in her posts, aside from claiming to have knowledge about some sort of role in the game, and claiming to not be a rolecop at the same time. How that works? I can't even begin to guess. But every point she's made is subjective, and can be to mean how she took it or how Phoenicks took it. The fact that Mido's being so aggressive with her side, without considering Nick's side strikes me as wrong.

Vote: Harpy

Now that I have your attention.

Is your feeling about Phoenicks rooted in a factual/circumstantial/evidential base or is it using the same reasoning that got Noivern lynched? While it'd be great, you don't necessarily need to answer this. Just keep it in mind while you two argue.

 

[Phoenicks]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

@Noivern; I understand the sentiment but sitting on the bench is not the way to go. Form an opinion.

As far as Mijz goes, I trust him for the time being. I'm getting mixed feelings from Buoy and Phoenicks, particularly @Phoenicks; I don't like the way you voted Noirvern just like that, mention him and threaten to vote but don't just do it. People are busy and can't always make time for defending themself, especially if they don't have any idea that they are being discussed. I wouldn't mention people in all cases but for important posts like voting and direct questions, I would. Makes me think you don't care as long as you are establishing the focus on somebody else. As well as that, I don't like you or Buoy's attitude. It's too aggressive for my liking. Innocent people are usually much cooler about the situation because they aren't experiencing the same kind of pressure.

Vote: Phoenicks

Reason being, I feel like he's trying to get attention off himself by placing rash votes and calling people out for petty reasons. I.E joke votes. This vote is not final, i'm fully open to hearing your defense.

What defense would you like me to give? I thought I'd been clear and communicated everything I have done.

There wasn't even any attention on me before I voted Noivern, so I'm not sure what to say in defense to that theory either.

What specifically are you accusing me of?

 

[Nytie]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

Vote: J J M

I'd still rather lynch an inactive at this point, as nobody is seeming particularly scummy to me yet. This vote is subject to change, depending on what we find out over the next few days.

 

[Almonds]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13

vote: Phoenicks

 

[Phoenicks]

Re: Mafia Wars: The Scum Menace - Day 2 - Snapshots (6/21/13