• Hey Trainers! Be sure to check out Corsola Beach, our newest section on the forums, in partnership with our friends at Corsola Cove! At the Beach, you can discuss the competitive side of the games, post your favorite Pokemon memes, and connect with other Pokemon creators!
  • Due to the recent changes with Twitter's API, it is no longer possible for Bulbagarden forum users to login via their Twitter account. If you signed up to Bulbagarden via Twitter and do not have another way to login, please contact us here with your Twitter username so that we can get you sorted.

Writers' Workshop General Chat Thread

I remember my first review ever was probably the harshest review I've never had too xD though granted I was a sucky writer back then. That was back when Blackjack Gabbiani was the only mod of the then Fanfic Corner and boy was she harsh, I have to admit she stuck with me for a while but her reviews were always kinda rude.

That being said I'm not harsh with my reviews, actually I should be harsher xD I usually point out what I like or didn't like in an honest manner. Sometimes I can like a story but I can still point out the bad things and sometimes I don't. I honestly wish I was a harsher reviwere :( I feel like my reviews suck.
 
Well, Blackjack was always a little...abrasive :/

Honestly, to me, it all comes down to whether or not the review was helpful. Once you know how to look for the things reviewers are actually trying to say (which might be very different from what they write), the tone of the review really doesn't matter. If people are gonna bitch, they're gonna bitch.
 
This stupid laptop keeps crying whenever I try to quote posts, aaargh :I

See, the reason why I write harsh reviews is because I am Ass Burger Girl with a c-c-c-combo hit of a naturally abrasive personality, no brain-to-mouth-filter, minimal ability to pretend to be a functional human being, asbolutely no empathy whatsoever, and a deepy-imbedded desire to give zero fucks, because in my opinion anyone who throws a tantrum about a less-than-polite review on their pokemon fanfic is taking fandom far, far too seriously.

I have tried - really, genuinely tried - to give reviews nicely, and without any bitchiness, but I have literally no idea what's socially appropriate to say, and there are people out there who will take offense at any criticism of their fic, no matter how politely-worded. So on the whole, it's simply too confusing for me to deal with and I don't want to expend valuable pretending-to-be-a-functional-human-being energy on people I don't even know and will probably never interact with again.

I really don't just want to stop reviewing, because it's something I genuinely enjoy doing - taking a story apart and looking at how it works and what the problems are - and it's also something I find very soothing and comforting to do if I'm unhappy.

So I only review people who ask for it and are presumably aware that I am a horrible person, because doing it that way creates maximum benefit along with minimum life stress on my side and minimum tantrums on the other person's side.
 
Last edited:
Gastly's Mama said:
The first review I ever got told me that I was a terrible writer. That was very upsetting.

Kelleo, I'm glad you found my review helpful, I often worry that I'm too harsh.
Click to expand...

There's never a need to tell the writer they're terrible. The story may be terrible to you, it may even be terrible to everyone, but that doesn't mean the author should be defamed. They can improve, after all.

R0-S3 said:
tell my wife and kids I love th--
Click to expand...

<3 Love you too. ;P

Thabet said:
I generally dislike overly harsh reviewers, even if they are helpful. Think of it this way. The writer has displayed effort, he/she sat there and wrote something down, even though they were under no pressure to do so, with no benefit to be gained other than a profound sense of accomplishment and happiness. Nevertheless, all the reviewer has to do is sit down and read, when they're done, if they feel like it, they comment about they like and what they didn't.

Personally, when I look it that way, I see no reason to be harsh with the writer, or insult them in any way. That being said, there is such a thing as being honest, firm and never sugar-coating it. In the end, the reviewer aims to help the writer improve.

First off, the best thing to be is objective. So you may not like the genre or plot, that's ok, but don't say it's 'shit' or 'bad', that's opinion not fact. Secondly, be honest, if you see something off, you say so, don't kiss ass or disregard anything, doing that means defeating the whole purpose of reviewing, assisting the process of improvement.

But the keyword here is RESPECTFUL. Respect the writer, respect their effort, respect the work itself.
Click to expand...

There's a lot to say to this, mm. Firstly, the writer may not have displayed effort, and they may have intended to gain the benefit of a lot of positive reviews. I'm sure you'll know what I'm talking about if you've ever been to FFN. Or, they may want to get good enough to publish, and publishers will be even harsher. Secondly, harsh reviewing does not mean 'insulting': firm candour, as you describe, is what I endorse but is viewed by many as harsh. But that's mere semantics. You're right to say that the review's purpose is to improve; if the review is unhelpful, it's useless.

I also must agree with your assertion on genre. When reviewing, one must review on the writer's own terms - who the love interest is is not an aspect up for debate, but the description of such certainly is. Critique how good the writing is, not what it is. (The exception being if the content is horribly offensive.)

And yes, respect is key. I cannot stress enough how much respect is to be valued. Thanks for bringing attention to this.

Gastly's Mama said:
See, I think it's all well and good wanting to point out the genuine issues with a story, but if you do it in a harsh way, people are going to be too upset/pissed off to actually take the criticism in. When people piss you off, you take an automatic disliking to them, and try to defend yourself. When people criticise my work in a way that I find rude or offensive, I find myself automatically leaping to my own defence (I can't always see this at the time, but can more easily when I look back at the events), whereas when people give me the same level of criticisms, but frame it in a nice way, I can actually easily take in what they're saying and use it to improve myself.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, pointing out the flaws and explaining how they can be improved is, in my opinion, only part of a good review. You also have to frame it in a way that the author is going to be able to use it easily. A lot of people like to say "I say the genuine problems with the fic, they need to be able to deal with it", but if you genuinely want to help a writer, that's not what you should be doing. The fact is that giving the really harsh, rude review that does genuinely point out all the flaws with a fic is just plain easier (and more fun) to write - it doesn't make you cool and it doesn't make you clever, anyone can be rude. The challenge in writing a review is getting your point across in a polite manner that is digestible for a reader. That is what makes a good reviewer. I'm not saying that I do it, as I've said I'm often concerned that I cross into rudeness (I'm glad Kelleo was happy with her review from me, but that doesn't mean that I've been as effective in all my reviews), but I certainly think this is what you should be aiming for when reviewing.
Click to expand...

In my honest opinion, people who get pissed off because an anonymous poster disliked their story are taking the internet too seriously. I'd understand if the reviewer was rude, or offensive, but harshness alone doesn't necessarily equate to that. And even so, the criticism is either valid or invalid, in which case, I think, one should either take it to heart or just disregard it. Don't get upset, cause haters gonna hate. My response to useless or inflammatory reviews is usually "troll harder," but I've yet to get such things here.

It's very true, though, that the review cannot simply state that there are flaws. The flaws must be identified, explained, and have solutions suggested in order to be as helpful as possible. The most insulting thing, I think, is when a reviewer claims you have flaws, but refuses to say what they are or how to improve - without seeming to realise that if the flaws exist, they probably aren't visible - or solvable - to the reader.

Lastly, GaMa, your review of DE was one of more measured, helpful ones I've received. It's exactly the sort of critique I appreciate most. Not rude at all~

LightningTopaz said:
What I like to do is phrase my criticism in the form of a question (eg. "I noticed X in this paragraph, is there a reason why you did this?") This way, the authors have a chance to tell you why they did what they did--what looks like a flaw to a reviewer could be artistic reason for the author
Click to expand...

It's good to make suggestions rather than assert your opinion as if it were immutable fact, though if an 'artistic choice' looks like a flaw, it could probably use improvement.
 
Anyways, how is everyone doing with their respective projects? I'm on a writing rush today! I have a side window open right now. I stop to check back here like every now and then.
 
Red said:
Anyways, how is everyone doing with their respective projects? I'm on a writing rush today! I have a side window open right now. I stop to check back here like every now and then.
Click to expand...

I love that feeling. I'm doing a little bit of writing today, but I've been busy sorting out my bedroom. I don't know if you guys know this but I'm moving back home to London with my parents to study a Master's degree this year. My girlfriend is doing the same, and today has actually moved in with me! My room is pretty large as it's the loft conversion and I even have a bathroom, so space-wise, I think it should be pretty solid, but it's taking a lot of effort to sort my room out so that it's actually possible for us to both live here.
 
I'm still waiting on my co-author to finish up his run over of the next Dawn of Darkness chapter. I found he and I have more in common than I thought too. What makes me most glad, though, is that he has Asperger's Syndrome, just like me. I've always wanted someone who has it to be a close friend. Now I've got one.

And yet another reason to love him. I wonder if it's odd to be in love with your co-author...
 
Not too well. I'm stuck on how to start the next chapter. I really shouldn't be thinking about it at all, though - I've got a 10-20 page script for my graphic novel that I've got to finish before the end of the week, a rewrite of the 3 page essay I've got to do tonight, and all this while leaving me time to study for my Southeast Asia final on Saturday.
 
I did some writing earlier, but Minecraft ate most of the day today.
 
Unfortunately for my writing, I made the mistake of promising reviews to seven different fics over the past week. I've had to give up some serious writing time.

Attempt to not sound like a whiny bitch: FAILED
 
My writing is going sloooooow.

Chapter 8 of Pocket Monsters is in the works, but my schedule isn't allowing me to really sit and grind out the chapter at the moment. :(
 
I've been a bit busy to write these past few days, but it's great. Being busy is amazing fun, believe it or not. Regardless, Chapter 6 of Something's Got To Give is in the works. Suddenly canon characters everywhere! But like I said, not much time to get down to it. Might have to take my laptop to school to get things done, what with all my banners and such that need making.

I'm currently busy with organising a general knowledge quiz for my school's prefects - versus the girl's school across town. It's gonna be great fun!
 
I eventually decided to say "screw it" for the paper re-write I was going to do. It's just not worth it, especially with how difficult scripts are for me. I'm doing well enough in that class I can afford a lower-than-I-wanted grade on one paper that's not even worth too much. That still leaves the script, though...I may just shoot for the minimum 10, and get by on the fact that the professor likes me.
 
I'm doing well enough with my current project - I've got the rest of the second chapter and a chunk of the third scrawled down in my notebook, as well as various lines and snippets for the next half-dozen chapters. I'll be typing them up as soon as I can stomach using this laptop to type anything of moderate length. If things keep going this well, I might even feel confident enough in my ability to continue the story to make it worth sticking it up here for public consumption.
 
R0-S3 said:
I'm doing well enough with my current project - I've got the rest of the second chapter and a chunk of the third scrawled down in my notebook, as well as various lines and snippets for the next half-dozen chapters. I'll be typing them up as soon as I can stomach using this laptop to type anything of moderate length. If things keep going this well, I might even feel confident enough in my ability to continue the story to make it worth sticking it up here for public consumption.
Click to expand...

If you're not 100% confident in your work, the worst thing you can do is keep it to yourself!

Everyone here is really friendly - people aren't going to make fun of you for your stuff being no good, and they will offer helpful suggestions. Once you get going in this community, it's really easy to improve. (I gather from your posts with uA that you're also active on ff.net, so I guess you know that already though? Personally, I've hardly been on ff.net though, so I don't know how it is over there - I would imagine similar in many ways.)
 
(I still can't quote things, because this laptop is stupid and evil aaaargh I can't wait until I get back to my computer.)

By 'confident' I didn't mean confident in my ability to write, I meant confident in my ability to keep writing the story and not get bored and wander off to do something different. I have a terrible attention span. (I am an extremely mediocre writer, but I am entirely unbothered by this.)

(Also: aaaw, no-one's going to make fun of me? That sucks. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only person who can be bothered to make fun of me, and it's very lonely.)

FF.N is quite different. Virtually all the reviews over there are some variation of 'cool story, bro. plz write moar', which... doesn't really help. I like in-depth reviews, especially the ones which are largely negative, so... FF.N just doesn't do it for me. And people over there are really hypersensitive when if comes to criticism! Even the ones who aren't hypersensitive don't like to take it - true story, I knew someone over there who near-constantly got told 'start a new paragraph each time someone speaks', and it took her about two years to finally start doing that. The whole place is just impossibly depressing.
 
Back
Top Bottom