Review DP183: Raise the Curtain! Shin'ō League - Suzuran Tournament!!

[Dogasu]

So you're saying that despite the fact that leagues come once every 4-5 years, (the Hoenn league aired back in 2005 for god sakes), and the fact that it took 183 DP episodes to get here, you think the writers should spend time on a boring TR plot that could be done in any filler episode instead of focusing on the battles?

Yes. Except, I wouldn't call the Rocket-Dan plot boring, because it wasn't.

You just don't like the plot because a) there's a language barrier preventing you from understanding what they're saying, and b) you want League episodes to be 95% battles. I, on the other hand, have neither of those problems.

This is on top of the fact that Ash is using older Pokemon that haven't been seen in 400 episodes. You do realize the last time Ash's Johto starters/Noctowl have been used in battle was back in 2002 in the Johto league? So they come back, where is their screentime? We waited 8 years for Ash to get a Quilava, and it gets 2 minutes of screentime?

Reruns aren't going anywhere.

Future appearances by the pokemon aren't going anywhere, either. You have absolutely zero proof that the pokemon won't be "redeemed" (whatever the fuck that means) in future episodes.

Besides..."we waited 8 years for ash to get a Quilava?" Really? You actually thought the pokemon was going to evolve back when you were writing one of your many bitchy rants about how much the Jouto team sucked?

Its too bad, to be honest, the writers have no problem with shoving Brock into the background and ignoring his existence, why not do the same for TR in important eps like this?

Because there are people out there who still like the Rocket-Dan.

 

[CrazyYanmega]

Is it just me, or is Koji looking much more creepy than usual?

And it looks like Lucian has a Darkrai.

 

[Piplup]

I think TRio should get their side plot, but they shouldn't recieve so much focus that it make us actually miss parts of Ash's battle and get too many one hit knock outs
Oh well, maybe it was just to set up their League plot and next eps they won't need to focus on it as much, since it was already explained what they're doing there and they managed to get customers so they shouldn't have problems anymore

Anyway... I noticed the gold and silver colors in this attached pic
No way I'll believe that was a coincidence, I'm 100% it was intentual, just like the gold and silver in the Galactic final eps

 

[Hellion]

I think TRio should get their side plot, but they shouldn't recieve so much focus that it make us actually miss parts of Ash's battle and get too many one hit knock outs

Exactly, people aren't pissed because TR is getting a subplot, they're pissed because the quality of the battle suffered from it. Let's face it, we see Team Rocket every single week and we see Ash's old pokemon every 3-4 years (they should spread them during the season more but keep the gyms to the regional team... IMO). So yeah... people are pissy because half the episode was Team Rocket being sorta funny while some characters miss out on their developpement and their focus. They could have been funny in 1-2 minutes and the rest of the episode could have been to Ash. I mean Quilava's new move used in an official battle and a fossil pokemon used in the League, both firsts, were cut down for Team Rocket selling Octillery sweets.

I consider pokemon as individual characters, so to me, they're just as important if not more important then TR.

Oh well, maybe it was just to set up their League plot and next eps they won't need to focus on it as much, since it was already explained what they're doing there and they managed to get customers so they shouldn't have problems anymore

I don't know... purple lady makes me nervous that TR will get a lot of focus... Oh well, can't be worse then their spammage in the Indigo League.

 

[Zwampert]

Is it just me, or is Koji looking much more creepy than usual?

And it looks like Lucian has a Darkrai.

I'd say it looks more like Karen considering she is a Dark type trainer and Darkrai is a Dark type.

 

[dman_dustin]

Yes I'm back (if any of you bothered to check my user page at all from Monday Night to Friday morning, US mountain time), and most of you (I can tell) are going to really dislike my first post since a few days. So if you want a long read, than get some popcorn otherwise, skim it, and just skip onto the next post (actually the last sentence best summarizes by thoughts on this episode; in fact I'll bold it).

Because there are people out there who still like the Rocket-Dan.

Except even a few "Rocket-Dan" fans like Musashi (don't know if she changed her mind, or if because I read 10 pages I misread the username) disliked the fact that Team Rocket got so much screentime in this episode.

Putting this Team Rocket Rant in Spoilers, because it's long.

Spoiler

And I agree of course I dislike when Team Rocket gets a lot of focus before/during an important moment, so maybe I'm a little biased.

Anyway regardless of what you (Okay now, just to be clear, I'm done with Dogasu, so any "you" in my post from now on is now for the general fans who watched this, but yes, Dogasu is included but not directed at) but anyone who actually liked the plot of Team Rocket, kind of ignores the fact that's the same damn thing only with shiny new paint. It's like the DS Lite (Sinnoh) to the DS (Hoenn). Team Rocket had a sucky time at the Hoenn League; they had a horrible mean boss but acknowledged their work when they sold a lot, ending in him giving them a crappy shack at the end of the league causing them to focus on the Pokemon thievery ending in them being "blasted off again" by their boss.

So while there are some differences, a lot can be drawn from the previous. Team Rocket are again selling stuff at the league, their "mean boss" gives them the most horrible location then some idea of free stuff get them rolling and their boss notices. Great and Grand, only one problem, Team Rocket never usually sucks at selling crap at major events. It's very similar to everything they've done. Team Rocket sold out at the Grand Festival, and they usually always come up with idea to make their "Concession Stand" work just like in the Twinleaf Festival when they added "BS" backstory about how James was the best Goldeen catcher when he was younger, beat some Master dude, and got a lot of money from it because that guy didn't get all the Goldeen. This resulting them in selling food later in the arc.

So yes it's the same repetitive and boring crap we get from them. Mixing it all together, adding a new coat of paint isn't going to change that fact. It may work for remakes of games and stuff (usually) but it doesn't work here. It might have been okay if it wasn't at the cost of the match. They spent way too much on something we've seen variations of; especially since they have around 7 or so episodes to actually flesh out this Team Rocket subplot, I just fear what B.S. the writers are going to pull just to cheapen matches just for Team Rocket (who aren't apparently going anywhere). I'll laugh my ass of (because it would be funny) and be pissed off (because of what the league would be rushed for) at the same time if Team Rocket's boss locked them in some basement as her worker slaves.

Okay for those who said they enjoy Human Characters more than Pokemon Characters, and said you were fine with the battle because Nando and Ash had no real rivalry. While half true (about Nando not having a rivalry with Ash), you clearly are biased and for Team Rocket. Because if you simply liked Human Characters more (just in general), you probably would've preferred more human interaction for a non-existent rivalry between Nando and Ash (maybe even some backstory similar to Tyson and his Meowth) more than the Team Rocket subplot. So I guess what you meant to say "I like IMPORTANT/Main Human Character plots more than Pokemon Characters and Pokemon battles."

Which is fine I guess, but still a little too biased. There are times when I didn't care or dislike Team Rocket-centric episodes. Like the one where they tried to recruit Team Rocket Members, if I remember correctly I didn't mind that one at all (if I was upset, I was more upset on what the "recruiting" technique was about, rather than it being about Team Rocket episode), and while I did sort of disliked the "Team Rocket Noodle Episode" it was only the placement I disliked (since that episode turned out good). The only Team Rocket episode that I disliked entirely was the less than recent Meowth episode for various reasons or another, like I may have said somewhere, it did have it's moments, but it was simply an episode that came way too late, as well as having a stupid placement in the anime timeline of episodes. So I don't hate Team Rocket, I'm mostly apathetic, and if they get something decent, fine, if I did hate them it would be because the writers give them too much and especially of certain circumstances and it looks like the writers cut corners, as if they had to fill out the episode and the only thing they could use was Team Rocket. And even some of you "Rocket-dan" hardened fans know what I'm talking about too since some of you hated Team Rocket being used for some of the episodes because it's like they only had the option to use them as opposed to being creative.

Alright I'm done with Team Rocket (for the most part, I'll make a quick reference to them but I won't dwell on it). Anyway onto the other stuff of the episode not relating to Team Rocket.

I liked how the Darkrai Trainer was introduced. It was just hilarious to see Barry not really notice until "She" passed him. I swear if Darkrai's trainer turns out to be a guy, I'm going to vomit, as interesting as a guy with long hair would be they gave him too many feminine features: I think "she" was hearing a shirt with no sleeves, like most girls wear), and I think "she" was wearing lipstick. The point is I'm referring to Darkrai's Trainer as a she (and no I don't think it's Karen, since that makes little to no sense, and as cool as it would be, Karen shouldn't just get a lowly appearance, especially if Ash is going to beat at least one of her Pokemon (hopefully Darkrai). Anyway loved her introduction. Yes I know she should've showed up earlier, but come on let's be realistic; Like let's say you move to Japan and they are holding some pre-tournament tournament just like the Pokemon League, you get X number of wins, and you're qualified for the big Tokyo Tournament, how many of the Tournament Qualifiers are you likely to know, especially one that ends up beating you? It's the same like this, as cool and nice as it would be for all the Regional League Competitors to show up previously before, it's too perfect and unrealistic. At least they tried to do something different. They introduce Darkrai, and that she apparently has a creepy personality. "She" may end up being one of my favorite League Trainers. I'll even like "her" more than Katie of course I already like Darkrai's trainer more, but we'll see there's a chance they (the writers) could drop the ball on this one.

Honestly I think the only person who doesn't dislike Conway (within the anime) is Ash. Brock, Dawn, and Barry were extremely creeped out by Conway, but earlier Ash was excited to see him (apparently Hikari refuses to say "Kohei" and it's Ash that identifies him). Anyway Conway was pretty good in this episode, but I think they dabbled too much of his creepiness in the beginning of the episode, during the match was perfect, but I think he said too much prior to that scene. Regardless Conway was pretty hilarious in this episode.

As for the matches:

Roserade vs Staraptor- Eh it was really rushed but I was okay with it. I'm sure they could've made it better, but I really like the brave bird attack knock out, just shows how strong Staraptor is. And his record still stands, he has always knocked out one of the opponent's Pokemon before falling. Honestly though I wouldn't mind if VS. Roserade is all it gets during the league, if only because we know it's powerful, possibly rivaling Swellow in strength, and I'd much rather see Noctowl the remaining time as Ash's flying Pokemon. Even against Paul, the only purpose Staraptor would serve is a quick knockout without winning anything and being "One Hit Knockout" fodder for Paul. To be honest even though I don't expect it at all (so don't judge me) my dream match up against Paul would be for Gliscor to replace Staraptor and have Gible being the "One Hit Cannon Fodder" that way 5 of Ash's Pokemon could at least get one win (Pikachu, Torterra, Gliscor, Infernape, Buizel) while 1 of the 5 could get 2 (like Infernape). Now before you piss on Gliscor, keep this in mind, Gliscor would struggle, but Ash would come up with his own strategy to win the match. So no matter what B.S. you think it would be, the fact is McCann's training did jack, and it was up to Ash to come up with something. So like I said, we know Staraptor is powerful the only thing it "will" become is "one-hit knockout fodder" and I'd really dislike it.

Armaldo vs Quilava- Straight up B.S. if only because of the writers over use of Team Rocket (there's the reference I mentioned earlier). I wouldn't have minded a tie, but honestly what the hell? The only 2 good things that came out of this was Quilava had Aerial Ace, and Armaldo fell first (even though the referee said nothing until after the fact Quilava fell). But seriously we didn't see crap here. I wouldn't mind if it was Barry or Paul battling some person we don't give a flying crap here. But Dawn and Jessie had a longer contest battle in the Grand Festival then this match up, which was what 10 seconds (mostly frustrated joking, but still it was almost a blink and miss moment), hell I think one who got bored of Team Rocket in that one scene would take off his headphones (if he/she was wearing one) stretch come back and it would be Heracross vs Kricketune and they'd go "What the hell? What happened to Quilava and Armaldo?" Like Unown Lord pointed out, hopefully once Infernape has his victory over Paul, hopefully Ash will use Quilava again VS. Darkrai Trainer.

Heracross vs Kriketune- The only thing I disliked was the fact Heracross had to prove itself against a Kricketune. Sure Nando's Kriketune was bad ass, but at the same time it's a Kricketune (something not that impressive). So my point is, did Heracross prove how strong it was by defeating a Kricketune, or was it not enough of a challenge to say Heracross is one of Ash's top ten strongest Pokemon? I mean yes a win is a win and I love it after the crap they pulled with Spenser, Heracross deserved it, but if anything it just replaces the loss it had against Spenser, and scrubs it out of existent. Honestly vs Armaldo probably would've been more of a impressive win, but I'll take what I get. So even though I dislike Heracross's opponent it was still the best thing of the episode. Heracross knew Sleep Talk and Focus Punch and Ash didn't even have to figure it out he already knew (just like with Quilava's aerial ace), so it was pretty epic to see Nando's sleep strategy fail. And the final Megahorn to knockout Kricketune, there is possibly no better representation of that than what we saw.

So for my final thought on the episode, it wasn't the best, nor was it really any good in terms of a league episode, but Heracross vs Kricketune definitely made me like this episode, it can't overpower all the negative things that can happened but it still gave it an edge that made this episode fairly decent although I think the writers cut too many corners in here. So again while the episode was decent, the writers could've made this episode better, but didn't choose to.

 

[Piplup]

What I really liked about this battle was Ash's choice of Pokémon
He chose the flying Staraptor and fire Quilava and then his starring Pokémon for that battle was Heracross - his own bug type who is also a fighting type who has an advatage on Lopunny the normal type AND knows Sleep Talk to deal with Nando's known sleep attacks
Though I'm surprised Nando didn't try to do something new after Zoey clearly said she expected him to use sleep attacks in the GF and intentually chose Mismagius against him... especially when he knows Ash watched that battle... I think Nando said something about sticking to his own battle style, so maybe that has something to do with that (I guess he likes to use music related attacks? that fits his character...)

 

[DashingFox]

^Agreed. I really like how Satoshi sat and talked about what types and Pokemon he should use before the battle. The only thing that made me wonder though, is the order he chose Magmarashi and Heracross. Wouldn't Heracross have been a better choice against Armaldo?

 

[hhhhdmt]

The quilava battle was rubbish. Poorly done. But the other battles were pretty good. Overall a good ep but not as great as i thought it would be

Still i am glad that ash's johto team is getting stronger. With Cyndas evolution and it learning eruption and aerial ace. And with Heracross finally learning a fighting type move. Lets hope Todo, Bayleef and Noctowl also learn new moves.

 

[Kaiten]

I really do hope that they allow quilava to be in another battle. If they don't show quilava in better battle than this, I feel that evolving him in the first place be useless. I only really like heracross's battle it was really exciting. Loved seeing as Ash use his head and countering Nando's known sleep attacks with sleep talk. Staraptor battle was too short and he got koed in one move against Armaldo. Hopefully, the writers will focus more on battles and not on tr little side story on running a shop. I mean take up and entire battle just for them is going a bit too far.

 

[Cybersai]

you want League episodes to be 95% battles. I, on the other hand, have neither of those problems.

The league eps are so rare that yes, I'd rather most time be spent on the battles. We see TR in every single episode anyway, surely they can be ignored for this arc?

I like human interaction, I loved the Paul/Barry/Conway scenes for example. But that's part of this arc, so it makes sense. TR are unneeded here, and in most Gym eps for that matter.

Besides..."we waited 8 years for ash to get a Quilava?" Really? You actually thought the pokemon was going to evolve back when you were writing one of your many bitchy rants about how much the Jouto team sucked?

If they're going to bring them back, at least give them good screentime. If that was Quilava's only battle in the league, that's just pathetic.

 

[Geodude]

Heracross vs Kriketune- The only thing I disliked was the fact Heracross had to prove itself against a Kricketune. Sure Nando's Kriketune was bad ass, but at the same time it's a Kricketune (something not that impressive). So my point is, did Heracross prove how strong it was by defeating a Kricketune, or was it not enough of a challenge to say Heracross is one of Ash's top ten strongest Pokemon? I mean yes a win is a win and I love it after the crap they pulled with Spenser, Heracross deserved it, but if anything it just replaces the loss it had against Spenser, and scrubs it out of existent. Honestly vs Armaldo probably would've been more of a impressive win, but I'll take what I get. So even though I dislike Heracross's opponent it was still the best thing of the episode. Heracross knew Sleep Talk and Focus Punch and Ash didn't even have to figure it out he already knew (just like with Quilava's aerial ace), so it was pretty epic to see Nando's sleep strategy fail. And the final Megahorn to knockout Kricketune, there is possibly no better representation of that than what we saw.

I think you just answered your own question.

The only thing that made me wonder though, is the order he chose Magmarashi and Heracross. Wouldn't Heracross have been a better choice against Armaldo?

To answer both of you, it was clear to me that Ash saved Heracross to battle Kricketune on purpose. Remember that he's seen Nando's Pokemon several times before (except Armaldo of course), so he knew Kricketune had a sleep move that Heracross could easily counter. Otherwise he might not have sent out Quilava to face a type disadvantage against Armaldo.